Uninformed Recap: Ravens Beat Steelers in OT, 20-17

by Brandon on Nov 30, 2009 7:00 AM CST in Analysis Comment 44 comments

The Steelers at Ravens game was a twofer. Here's the boxscore. It had 2 of the Green Bay Packers' next 3 opponents.

In between their games against the Ravens and Steelers, the Packers play the Bears in Chicago. I watched a little of the Bears at Vikings game, but what I did see was ugly (for the Bears). Their defense has looked bad for weeks, and they couldn't do anything to stop the Vikings. 537 yards for the Vikings, and the Bears only had 169. In the 2nd quarter, despite their meager offensive performance, the Bears drove twice into Vikings territory, only to watch QB Jay Cutler throw back-to-back drive killing INTs. And why did they give up their (high) 2nd round pick in 2010 for DE Gaines Adams? He only has 3 tackles in 6 games.

As far as the Steelers at Ravens game goes, my recap is uninformed because I don't know a lot about either team. They both have great defenses, through week 11, according to Football Outsiders, the Steelers had the No. 3 defense and the Ravens' D was No. 4.

The Steelers were able to run straight up the middle, which was where RB Rashard Mendenhall, who had 24 carries for 95 yards (4.0 YPC), went every time he carried the ball. The Ravens D might have lost a step. Just as the Packers have lost Kampman and Harris, the Ravens have lost their top pass rusher, LB Terrell Suggs (torn MCL), and a starting cornerback, Fabian Washington (torn ACL). But the Steelers were forced to start 2nd year QB Dennis Dixon, his first career start, and he was just overmatched. On the Steelers final offensive play, Dixon misread a zone blitz and he threw an INT right at the Ravens' rookie defensive lineman. Overall, Dixon only completed 12 of 26 attempts for 145 yards, but you could tell at times during the game that the Steelers offensive coordinator had lost some faith in him.

The Ravens offense is built around getting the ball to WR Derrick Mason and RB Ray Rice. Though WR Mark Clayton had a big game, 7 catches for 129 yards, that was due in large part to the awful coverage by Steelers CB William Gay. Mason is still a good, Donald Driver type receiver. Rice is an explosive playmaker and he's maybe even more dangerous as a receiver. I don't see how any team can cover him with a linebacker. Despite generating 393 yards of offense, it was boom-or-bust. Most of that yardage came on their 3 scoring drives, while the rest of the time they struggled and were forced to punt 6 times. Their offense isn't any better than the Vikings or Cowboys.

And while the Packers are still No. 1 in most penalty yards allowed per game, the Ravens are a close 2nd. They had 9 penalties for 80 yards against the Steelers, including a killer special teams penalty that erased a huge punt return near the end of regulation. If that return hadn't been called back, the Ravens would likely have kicked a late game winning FG, instead of having to win in OT.

The Packers and Ravens are two comparable teams, and both teams need to keep winning to keep pace for a wild card spot.

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Larry Johnson

And in other news around the league, I’d like to point out that Larry Johnson rushed 22 times for over 100 yards for the Bengals this week…and that was splitting carries with Bernard Scott who also had 18 carries. While that doesn’t mean he’ll be some beast this year, I think it shows he certainly has something left in the tank. I think he could have added a real interesting element to Packers and our mediocre and now dinged up running game.

by TrevorR on Nov 30, 2009 9:28 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

It was against the Browns

Who are a week removed from making Matthew Stafford look like Peyton Manning.

by Charlie Kelly on Nov 30, 2009 11:44 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Larry Johnson is a running back though…I get your point that was a bad way of putting it! The Lions didn’t run all over them and either did the Ravens the week before.

by TrevorR on Nov 30, 2009 1:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Ravens

I’ve been saying for a few weeks now that the Raven’s are a very beatable team. They aren’t a bad team, just not playing as well as I’ve seen them play. Flacco looked a little better this week, they were actually throwing it downfield which was a nice thing to see (he’s my backup in fantasy haha) but I still am not sold on the Ravens being a team I am afraid of. I think they are good…just like I think the Packers are good so if we come with a good gameplan and keep Ray Ray away from Aaron I think we can definitely win that one.

If Ben is playing when we face the Steelers, I have a hard time seeing us winning that one. Troy being out helps a TON though and makes their secondary beatable as we’ve seen lately.

by TrevorR on Nov 30, 2009 9:35 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Agreed

The Ravens are good much like we are. I’m interested to see how we look against their 3-4 since our offense has been facing our 3-4 pretty much all year. We need to shut down Rice but unfortunately I don’t know how we’re going to do that and I don’t think anybody really has shut him down thus far.

I think even if Ben plays against us, which is likely, we still have a good chance at beating them. He has struggled this year with zone blitzes and being able to find his hot reads. He is a good Qb but he normally does make a few mistakes per game which bodes well for us with Woodson, Collins, and Williams.

Even if Polamalu plays we should be able to exploit Gay all game long. He is somewhat slow, and doesn’t move his hips very well and couldn’t cover Clayton last night to save his life. Imagine what a Driver or Jennings could do against him.

by packallday555 on Nov 30, 2009 10:47 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

The good thing is that the Ravens are one of those teams where we can use Woodson in his most effective way since they don’t have a top notch WR. Tramon can easily handle Mason and no one else is worth much of anything in that WR group. That leaves Brad Jones and Woodson to work on Rice which might be a good combo. We did a nice job with Gore a few weeks ago and Kevin Smith didn’t kill us last week so hopefully that bodes well for us containing him.

by TrevorR on Nov 30, 2009 1:58 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

who is tramon

and why are you so sure he can “easily” handle Mason?

(I’m a Ravens fan.)

I only ask that because despite Mason’s lack of explosive athletic ability, he does routinely torch young and inexperienced CBs, even when they clearly have the athletic advantage over him.

It is true that we don’t have a top-notch WR, and I agree in large part with the “boom-or-bust” assessment of our offense, but boom or bust offenses can sometimes boom. While our receivers aren’t great, they do have reliable hands and Flacco is an accurate passer (setting aside the high-balls and missed reads that I expect him to correct as his career progresses).

"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden

by jackmca on Nov 30, 2009 3:54 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

for the packers D, we like to run Harris and Tramon Williams out to play man on

as both are excellent coverage corners.

We then unlease Woodson to make the big plays from the nickle.

However, the loss of Harris meant that Bush(not very good) would have to be our nickle back with Woodson playing coverage, but if your team only has one top notch reciever, than we can still afford to play Woodson in the nickle with Tramon and someone else playing man on (I think)

See, this is what happens when the Sox bunt.
Discord is sown. Brother fights brother. Misunderstandings abound.

-TAEG

by blackoutsox on Nov 30, 2009 4:36 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

meh,

we run a lot of 2-wide sets so i’d keep your talent on the field. We might not be the Cardinals, but if you sleep on our passing game we can put up big numbers. Flacco’s QB rating is a 90.2 and he’s on pace to throw for just under 4000 yards.

"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden

by jackmca on Nov 30, 2009 4:39 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

If you run two wide sets, then it may be best to keep just Woodson and Williams only

with Collins and Bigby at safety, a more conventional 3-4

because Bush really sucks

See, this is what happens when the Sox bunt.
Discord is sown. Brother fights brother. Misunderstandings abound.

-TAEG

by blackoutsox on Nov 30, 2009 4:45 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

sounds like a good plan.

You need to force us to throw the ball downfield. If you jump out to an early lead, we might abandon the run. That has happened before. Your ideal situation is to have us playing from a 7-point defecit or more and to be stopping us on running plays. That makes it easy for you to predict passing downs and it forces Flacco to push the ball downfield. In those situations, Flacco takes sacks, his receivers aren’t great, and the Packers will stand a very very good chance of winning the game.

"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden

by jackmca on Nov 30, 2009 5:04 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I think this is probably what the coaches will do. You might see the Packers take a few shots downfield to see if they can take advantage of the corners in Baltimore. I don’t see the Packers having too much luck running the ball. I think the Packers HAVE to come out planning to get up quickly.

by TrevorR on Dec 1, 2009 10:43 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

i must say, the prospect of Dominique Foxworth covering either Jennings or Driver is very scary to me. Foxworth can’t tackle to save his life so I don’t like the idea of him on Driver, and if Santonio Holmes owned him that badly on Sunday night, I loathe to think of what Jennings could do to him.

Our pass rush will need to come to the rescue and hit rogers hard and often. if we can bat-down balls, cause fumbles, or hit him as he’s throwing, we can force turnovers. If we can’t force turnovers, you’ll score, simple as that.

"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden

by jackmca on Dec 1, 2009 1:39 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Flacco

He WAS on pace for that but that was early in the season when the passing game was really clicking. You can’t watch their games now and not see the struggles in the passing game. I like Flacco too…he’s going to be a good QB (he’s one of my fantasy QBs and started a few times) but I a large part of his yards are to Rice. that doesn’t take away from Flacco but strengthens the point about the WR group in Baltimore.

by TrevorR on Dec 1, 2009 10:42 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

his current pace is for 3991 yards. I just did the math.

"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden

by jackmca on Dec 1, 2009 1:39 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

You can’t watch their games now and not see the struggles in the passing game.

again, it’s boom-or-bust. There are certainly times when our passing game looks pitiful. But there are other times when Flacco seems to morph into Drew Brees and he connects with 5 different receivers on a single drive. He is very good and is on the verge of taking the next step.

"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden

by jackmca on Dec 1, 2009 1:41 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Tramon is Tramon Williams. He was our #3 CB who is now filling Harris’ shoes. Honestly in THIS defense I actually like Tramon more…Harris is better suited for a man, bump and run style.

The reason I said what I did is that while I think Mason is a pretty good WR, he doesn’t have blazing speed and he’s not elite. I think elite WRs at this stage would eat tramon up but just above average ones he can hang with.

I am actually a fan of the Ravens. I LOVE that Rice kid they have now…he’s scary good. But Mason doesn’t strike fear into a team with some of the better corners in the league. That doesn’t mean he’ll shut Mason down…don’t mistake me for saying that. I think Mason will do okay but I see 4 for 50 or so being tops for him.

by TrevorR on Dec 1, 2009 10:38 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

yeah 4 rec for 50-ish yards sounds about right. But I could see mason getting 50 yards, Clayton getting 60, Heap getting 35, Rice getting 75, Washington getting 40, and so on… Flacco has had games like that before.

Then again, this could be one of those games where Mason has 75 yards, Rice has 75 yards, and nobody else has anything and you beat us 30-10. It’s really tough to predict how the ravens passing game will fare since they’ve struggled against poor secondaries and they’ve caught fire against respectable ones.

"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden

by jackmca on Dec 1, 2009 1:44 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

555 you are right...

Ray Rice is my biggest concern for the Ravens Offense. If we can stop him or even limit him I dont see them putting up many points on that side of the ball aleast.

The steelers secondary is the weak link on that D. Ike Taylor was not doing any better covering Clayton as Gay was. Taylor had that PI and IC that set up the Ravens for that chance to win it in regulation. We have way better WRs than the Ravens but we need time for them too. The Steelers were able to get to Flaco 5 times…

And with Big Ben. He has been sacked alot too. Their OL is not as bad as ours but it is still pretty bad. Hopefully we can make him have a few mistakes.

by bizzle4 on Nov 30, 2009 2:12 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Ravens pass protection is inconsistent

at times it has been admirable, and at times it’s been poor. It’s hard to predict. Oher only allowed one sack against Jared Allen, and that was on a mistake play where Oher didn’t even initiate contact with Allen and Allen went in completely untouched.

Likewise, your pass protection doesn’t have great numbers. Suggs won’t be playing, but he had been underperforming following a massive contract extension and Jarret Johnson #95 has been our best pass rusher this year anyway. Not to say we don’t miss suggs, but our defense has done well in his absence, holding Indy and Pitt to 17 points each.

"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden

by jackmca on Nov 30, 2009 3:57 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Ravens D hasn't been a traditional 34 in the Capers sense

we use a lot of variable formations up front and often come out with 2, 3, or 4 down linemen. You’ll see Jarret Johson and Paul Kruger shift over and put their hands in the dirt to make it more or less a 43 look.

Game tape, game tape, game tape. Our defense is good but not great as it has been in the past. WIth enough game tape you can begin to understand our defensive tendencies. But the scheme is a relatively unique one in the NFL today.

"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden

by jackmca on Nov 30, 2009 4:09 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Actually

Capers run a lot of different formations amd variations in our 3-4 defense as well. Of course their not the same defensive schemes but having gone against a 3-4 as opposed to a 4-3 will likely help us in our preparation.

by packallday555 on Nov 30, 2009 5:18 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

no doubt, no doubt

"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden

by jackmca on Nov 30, 2009 5:23 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Dubious D Claim

I don’t know if I’m willing to buy The Steelers and Ravens being the number 3 and 4 ranked defenses, respectively. Without Polamalu, the Steelers have been pretty terrible at stopping anything in the middle. The Ravens defense has looked good against teams they’re supposed to beat, but let contender teams have a pretty good day against them.

What the Steelers really have is an amazing, undervalued offensive line. Those guys create plays for their offense and even kept Dixon from having a disastrous day. More than once, their tenacity kept him from being ground down and spread like pate over the playing field and let him get off passes he held a pretty long time. Defensive play calling will have to be pretty good in order to make them a non factor.

As far as the Ravens are concerned, all the Packers need is to treat them like a contender team. If a solid effort is put out by them , I don’t see the Ravens coming within 10 pts. of the Pack.

by AdamA on Nov 30, 2009 9:51 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

contender teams have a pretty good day against them

yes and no. Early in the season we sure did look pretty awful on defense, but in the last few weeks our younger players have been coming into their own more and more. I see a ravens defense that is undergoing a lot of personell transitions, and they’re improving rather than regressing. Note that Manning threw two picks and only scored 17 points against us.

The steelers O-Line is improving, but “amazing” would be the overstatement of the century. They were awful last year and still managed to win the SB, and this year they’ve been improved but not excellent. I’d say they’re a “B” grade O-Line, with the Ravens’ O-Line being a “B” to an “A-” depending on what side of the bed they get out of…

"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden

by jackmca on Nov 30, 2009 4:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Best Game Yesterday....

Titans/Cards

99-yards, three 4th down conversions and a no time left on the clock TD pass… all engineered by Vince Young….

Exciting…

Goooooo-mez!

by Drew C on Nov 30, 2009 10:07 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

I was really impressed

by how calm and in charge Vince was during that final drive. Really, really impressive game.

Oh, and how much must Matt Leinart hate Young by now? LOL

by swilldog on Nov 30, 2009 2:17 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I don't understand this comparison:

Their offense isn’t any better than the Vikings or Cowboys.

Those are two pretty darn good offenses to be comparing to. They are #4 & 5 in total yards, and the Vikes are second in total points. The Cowboys, as has been pointed out, is crazy hit or miss week to week. They can put up the numbers, though.

The little I have seen of the Ravens has raised questions about their defense. I would say they definitely lost a step. The injuries and age really seem to be hurting them. This is a winnable game for the Pack.

Some people say the glass is half empty, some say half full. I say, are you going to drink that?

by BleedsbluinMI on Nov 30, 2009 10:07 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Their offense is NO where near the Vikings and really it doesn’t compare even with the Cowboys. They are closer comparison to the 49ers than either of those teams. A couple okay WRs, a very good pass catching RB, The Niners have a far superior TE, but the RAvens have a superior QB (though only compared the Niners).

by TrevorR on Nov 30, 2009 2:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

It's a compliment to the Vikings and Cowboys

The Ravens are not the best offense the Packers have faced all season. Both the Cowboys and Vikings are better than the Ravens.

by Brandon on Nov 30, 2009 11:28 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Packers need to be extremely gap disciplined

to contain Ray Rice… Steelers were over running and Rice just made one cut back and was gone for a huge gain several times… And when they get a hold of him, HOLD ON!

Goooooo-mez!

by Drew C on Nov 30, 2009 10:19 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Hopefully

We’ll be able to contain our gaps well enough to stop him. We’ve managed to slow some pretty good Rb’s down this year and I’m hoping we’ll be able to contain him as well.

I think the biggest concern should be him going out for passes out of the backfield.

by packallday555 on Nov 30, 2009 10:50 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

He’s electric…a really fun back to watch. Shifty. We are going to have to make sure to get solid tackles on him, no shoestring tackles are going to work on him.

by TrevorR on Nov 30, 2009 2:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

the secret to rice

is just watching a lot of game tape. Our offensive playcalling hasn’t been incredibly inventive and teams seem to be able to predict when we will call on Rice. We have a tendency to rely on him too much. If the backers have a good idea where he’s going to be and they can get two bodies on him, the defense wins. The defense loses when LBs are asked to cover him or when Rice has one-on-one situations when he has space to make guys miss.

If you know when to expect the screens and circle routes, you’ll at least be able to force him to change direction and give your other defenders time to fly to the ball. But if Flacco sees him 1v1 against a LB, you can expect that LB to get tested 9 times out of 10.

"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden

by jackmca on Nov 30, 2009 4:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I do like the fact we are playing the ravens after they had an emotional win against pittsburgh on sunday night football. Now they have to get back up after that big win in OT and play our packers at lambeau on MNF. Knowing that the pack got their second bye of the year by playing on Thanksgiving. This game is a must win. As bad as the Bears have been they will play us tough in the Windy City. Idk if we can beat the steelers. I hope Im wrong but Big Ben will be back and they are the only team thus far to pressure the vikings O-Line. Now they go against our O-line which has been the achillies heel for our team the whole year. Bottom line, if our O-Line performs, we have a chance to win all 3 games, but I believe we would have to play a PERFECT game to win in Pittsburgh. I’d take 2 out of 3 here.

by ajgraham on Nov 30, 2009 11:27 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

agree

I love this blog and I was thrilled to find it—- managed super well. Thank you. I agree with most of the posts. However, the Raven’s losses have come against playoff teams——-New England , bengals (twice), Indiana, and Minnisota. They ALL were close. IF the pack can stop the run and Rice receiving we can do it. I would make the case that Pittsburg is more beatable, only for the fact that they lost to the bad news bears and the Chief’s Go Pack Go

by turd on Nov 30, 2009 1:59 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Good point with the Ravens. Its hard to believe those games have all been so close cause they just don’t blow you away with their O…outside of Rice who’s spectacular. I would expect a lower scoring game maybe 24-17 or something like that.

by TrevorR on Nov 30, 2009 2:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Ravens O has shown moments, but not consistency.

In the vikings game our Offense found some sort of groove that resulted in 21 fourth quarter points. We have moments where we show flashes of unstoppability (just made up that word). Then we have our other moments where we seem to dink-and-dunk too much and we fail to surpass 20 points on the scoreboard.

The funny thing is it’s not really about the defenses we’ve played against. The vikings defense is WAY better than the Colts’ but our offense played FAR better in that game in Minny than it did at home against Indy. It’s kindof baffling. I could see you guys shutting us down and allowing 16 points, or I could see us catching fire and putting up 30. A lot of it depends on how you react to Rice and how much pressure you can get on Flacco.

"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden

by jackmca on Nov 30, 2009 4:14 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Was the Ravens in the playoffs last year?

I think just because they have A 6-5 record means nothing. Look at the level of their competition. Lets see the Steelers are SB Champs right? And they played Indy, Cinci (playoff contender), Vikes (playoff team). This makes this team dangerous. They have a winning record against them. They were a missed FG away from beating the Vikes. And staying on that subject if the Vikes and Packers played that kind of schedule they wouldn’t have the the records they have. So you have to treat this game like a playoff game, it would be agood measuring stick for us.

by cheddarhead on Nov 30, 2009 7:44 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Yeah, the Ravens did make the playoffs last year.

Went to the AFC Championship. As I recall, Pittsburgh mayor Luke Ravenstahl (sp?) changed his name because of the “Ravens” in it.

"I still believe, in spite of everything, that people are truly good at heart."
-Anne Frank-

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Nov 30, 2009 8:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

yeah we beat the 13-3 titans and took the steelers down to the wire (but lost all 3 times)...

but we’re not a pushover. we do have a tendency to blow games, however. Maybe the pitt game was a turning point for us. We shall see. The fact remains that we started off 3-0, then lost 3 straight, and we have alternated wins and losses since then. Hopefully we get 2 wins in a row but monday night in Lambeau won’t be easy.

"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden

by jackmca on Dec 1, 2009 12:04 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

You're right about the Ravens being inconsistent.

I’m trying to pick the straight-up winners of every NFL game this year (my record is 171 right, done twice), and Baltimore has been one of the trickiest teams to pick.

It seems every time I pick them to win, they lose, and every time I pick them to lose, naturally, they win. Although, I believe I did pick Baltimore to beat Pittsburgh.

"I still believe, in spite of everything, that people are truly good at heart."
-Anne Frank-

by Vermont Cubs Fan on Dec 1, 2009 1:35 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

that's been the trend

we were favored to beat cincy both times (lost both times), we were expected to lose to SD and Denver (beat both of them), most people thought we’d beat New England (lost to them).

Maybe we’ll continue that trend as most people seem to think the Pack has the advantage?

"Just win baby. Yeah, I stole that."
--Jon Gruden

by jackmca on Dec 1, 2009 1:46 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs