Missing Al Harris In The Packers' Secondary
by Brandon on Dec 22, 2009 7:00 AM CST
in Green Bay Packers Analysis
81 comments
I had been surprised at how well the Green Bay Packers' pass defense had held up in the first 3 games after CB Al Harris was lost for season with a torn ACL. But then came Big Ben and his 503 yards of passing offense. What happened against Pittsburgh that didn't happen in the previous three games?
Opponents: In the first three games without Harris, they played the Lions, Ravens, and Bears. Neither the Lions or Bears can throw the ball. The Ravens have a good pass offense, but RB Ray Rice is a large part of their passing success. The Ravens' don't have a dangerous wide receiver or tight end.
The loss of Harris against the Steelers hurt in the case of WR Santonio Holmes. He was covered for most of the game by CB Charles Woodson. But in past games, if a receiver was having a big game, such as TE Vernon Davis did back in November, the Packers could adjust and cover him with Woodson. But against the Steelers, the Packers couldn't make any adjustments. Woodson had to stay on Holmes or WR Hines Ward, and they had to rely on the recently signed CB Josh Bell. The additional losses of likely dime CB Pat Lee and backup CB Will Blackmon earlier in the season have robbed this unit of its depth, and Mike McCarthy said that "changing personnel frankly is not an option."
But the Steelers also presented another unique problem: they have four very good receivers. According to Football Outsiders, Ward, Holmes and WR Mike Wallace are all ranked among the Top 30 wide receivers. Also, TE Heath Miller is ranked in the Top 10 for tight ends. That's four receivers that deserve respect, and RB Rashard Mendenhall took advantage of that respect to find himself wide open a couple of times.
I'm not even talking about playoffs. The Packers have to win their next two games and then I'll talk about the playoffs. But looking at the rest of the schedule, expect to read stories about how well the Packers' pass defense responded to the poor game in Pittsburgh. Next up is the Seahawks, who's best receiver according to Football Outsiders is WR Nate Burleson, and he's likely out for the season. The Cardinals are more of a challenge but if they at least rest WR Larry Fitzgerald, he played through a knee injury last week, then their best receiver is WR Steve Breaston at No. 26 according to FO. Those are matchups the Packers can handle with their starters.
As far as next season goes, I would love to see them draft a defensive back in the 1st round who could play at cornerback or safety, and also push CB Jarrett Bush off the roster. Then draft an offensive tackle in the 2nd round as either a successor to LT Chad Clifton, or just provide them with better depth.
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I think
Seattle and Arizona are just going to throw the ball at Bush when he’s out there.
It’s a boondoggle…
Goooooo-mez!
by Drew C on Dec 22, 2009 8:18 AM CST via mobile reply actions
What about
Anquan Boldin? Where is he ranked on the FO list? He’s a pretty dangerous receiver.
Also, I think the team that most resembles the Steelers offensively is the Cardinals. They have three great, and one good WR, plus two dangerous running backs and a QB who is cool under pressure and can throw the ball all over the field. Plus they have a pretty decent defense (See game VS. Vikings).
I’m not saying the Packers couldn’t win, but Arizona has all the necessary tools to exploit our weaknesses.
Hopefully we can avoid them in the playoffs. Go PACKERS!
The thing
that scares me most about playing the Cardinals is Dom Capers play calling. I give the guy a lot of credit for turning this defense around but I’m starting to think he doesn’t understand how to game plan big-time QBs. Everyone knows that you have to get after Kurt Warner because he’s so accurate but can’t move. I could see Capers rushing three guys the entire game because he’s scared that Bush is gonna get burnt. He needs to stop calling plays thinking about the worst case scenario.
Just like Big Ben did on Sunday, Favre has lit up Capers defenses for his entire career (beaten him every single time) because Capers is afraid to pressure him. Just look at the two Vikings games this year. Everyone knows that pressure = turnovers for Favre, Warner, and Big Ben yet Capers is scared to blitz. That is vastly my largest concern come week 17 and possibly into the playoffs. And yes, don’t forget about Boldin. He’s as good as Fitzgerald when healthy.
by GGGamer on Dec 22, 2009 11:28 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Great point GG
I understand what Capers is saying about the big time Qb’s being able to shred the blitz but what does he think they’ll do when he only rushes 3-4 guys and gives them all the time in the world?
If we blitz and are able to get to the Qb in 3 seconds then I would say it’s safe to assume Bush would be more likely to cover his guy then if we rush 3 and Bush has to cover his guy for 5-6 seconds.
by packallday555 on Dec 22, 2009 1:28 PM CST up reply actions
And that's actually a great question PAD
Is 3 seconds of Bush coverage going to be better than 5-6? I have my doubts but we don’t really know. Think Dom does?
Best game I ever attended was the 163rd game last year.
by NorthSidePaulie on Dec 22, 2009 3:22 PM CST up reply actions
Yeah, I’m sure Dom does but we’ve seen now 3 times what happens when he only rushes 3-4 guys against really good Qb’s. I think the only thing left to do now is blitz, blitz, blitz, and hope the other team makes a few mistakes.
by packallday555 on Dec 22, 2009 4:31 PM CST up reply actions
Leroy Butler
said that if Capers is afraid of Jarrett Bush getting beat then why not send Bush in as a blitzer and let the other guys defend for a shorter period of time. That makes plenty of sense to me and Bush has actually shown to be a productive blitzer, one of the things he can actually do productively.
I think going crazy with blitzes is gonna get the defense burned for some huge TD’s but why doesn’t Capers just send the front 5 a bunch? Jones, Matthews, Jolly and Jenkins will get there in 2.5 seconds 9 times out of 10. Bush single handedly has Capers play calling scared.
I don’t necessarily think we should go crazy with the blitzes. I thought he should have called the game the way he had been for the last 4-5 weeks. He seemed to get away from the blitz against Pittsburgh, and as we saw dropping 7-8 into coverage just wasn’t getting it done.
It just seems like he gets to clever for himself at times. Did anybody else notice the play that he had Raji cover Heath Miller? How about continuing to drop Matthews into coverage despite the fact that he had dominated Starks all game.
Too me it just seems like sometimes he wants to try and do all these crazy things almost for the recognition of being this defensive mastermind (which he is). We’re at the point now where we know what generally works for our defense and generally doesn’t. It seems like every week there is some new scheme he has us running, and while that’s not a bad thing, I think sometimes it’s just too much.
by packallday555 on Dec 22, 2009 4:57 PM CST up reply actions
I know exactly what you're saying
I don’t think Capers has ever been considered an arrogant coordinator so I don’t think his crazy schemes have anything to do with him trying to continue his reputation as a defensive mastermind, I just think he tries to outsmart the opponent too much. He also has the biggest defensive playbook in the league and I think that can be a problem like you’ve mentioned.
He needs to go back to basics and chill out on the creativity a little bit. In regards to Raji, that was all Raji’s fault. I’m cracking up just thinking about it. Raji is suppose to wait until the snap and he dropped into coverage way before he was suppose to. The play was ruined right when he dropped back too early.
Trying to outsmart the opponent is the perfect way to describe it.
Haha ya that was certainly a funny site. The thing is he actually almost covered him haha! Your right, usually when your going to drop a d-lineman back into coverage you have him still line up on the line and then drop him back over the middle in hopes that the Qb will overlook him. Instead, he lined up right over Miller haha, and it’s probably safe to assume any Qb is going to notice a 6’ 330 lb. guy lined up over his TE.
by packallday555 on Dec 22, 2009 5:25 PM CST up reply actions
scared
DC said that he blitzed the first play and they scored a long TD so he laid off the rest of the game.
WTF?!?
we have guys that can get to the QB, Jenkins is awesome, Matthews, Jones, Jolly, etc.
Rush 4 and we will be fine.
Mix it up, rush Barnett, Hawk, etc at different times.
but do NOT give the playoff QB’s 5+ seconds to throw. We will lose in a hurry if we do.
Zone Blitz!
Do you guys have any idea what a zone blitz is?! Seriously, the fact that Raji dropped into coverage shouldn’t come as a surprise… A zone blitz overloads a zone of pass protection w/ more rushers than blocker, but at the same time usually (not always) drops another DL into coverage for a short area, to cover a weakness.
Really thought you guys knew this basic stuff of Capers D by now!!!
Haha um ya?
I knew that…We were just saying that Raji completely gave away the blitz by standing over Miller…I am completely aware of what a zone blitz is, don’t worry!
by packallday555 on Dec 23, 2009 12:05 PM CST up reply actions
zone blitz
Merry Christmas first of all!
Secondly, what in are comments would lead you to believe we don’t know what a zone blitz is? We were just saying Raji completely ruined it by standing up far too early. Thanks for the description of a zone blitz though, maybe others who don’t know Capers “basic stuff” now know.
True
But Big Ben obviously tore up the Packers secondary on the final drive with 8 seconds to throw everytime. I’m not even against Capers preference for not blitzing, I’m against his preference for sending only three guys.
I would bet a lot of money that if Capers would have just kept his best pass rusher, Matthews (Jenkins is in the argument) in to be the fourth pass rusher for the final drive, the Packers would’ve sacked Big Ben 2,3,4 times and won the game. Jenkins was getting pressure but there was no one else to gang sack Roethlisberger. Jenkins and Matthews would’ve brought him down a few times together and the Packers would’ve won the game.
Good point
If we were going to rush 3, it should have been Jenkins, Raji, and Matthews. Like you pointed out, Jenkins and Matthews were both getting to Ben nearly every time. The problem was, Ben is hard to bring down, and it seemed like a lot of the time it was only them getting pressure on him.
He had Matthews on Miller, which I understand because Hawk wasn’t doing well. My question is why not bring Chillar in to play the middle along with Barnett? That is what we gave him that extension for after all isn’t it?
That would have allowed Matthew to do what he does best, along with Jenkins, and I think your absolutely right in thinking that we would have gotten 2-3 sacks on that drive.
by packallday555 on Dec 22, 2009 5:04 PM CST up reply actions
gassed
Jenkins and Raji were gassed!! They were trying to rush that whole drive and needed a breather! Unfortunate it came on the last play, but they can’t keep rushing effectively all day. I would have preferred them on that particular play too, but if they were out it was cuz they asked out for a breath. Not cuz Capers didn’t want them in!!
Well I know
But even that is something we need to be aware of. If anything, put Poppinga and Wynn in there to spell them early on in the drive, so we can have them when it matters most.
by packallday555 on Dec 23, 2009 12:07 PM CST up reply actions
I think the hope is that by keeping the better guys out there, that it won’t come to the 3 seconds left 20 yard TD throw. This time it did but you want your best guys out there so you can avoid getting to that point I would think!
I thought about this too but realistically it’s probably inevitable that they were going to get down to our 20 with us playing the prevent defense we were. I don’t know it’s just frustrating to see Matthews dropping into coverage, and Raji and Jenkins on the bench.
by packallday555 on Dec 23, 2009 4:23 PM CST up reply actions
+1
Totally agree with this point.
Best game I ever attended was the 163rd game last year.
by NorthSidePaulie on Dec 22, 2009 3:21 PM CST up reply actions
Cardinals fan chiming in.
Kurt Warner burns the blitz a lot. If you blitz all day it’s lights out. If you can get pressure on him with 3-5 rushers and cover the receivers then they will have much more trouble. Against the blitz he’ll deliver the ball to the hot read or dump it to the RB. That is why Tim Hightower has so many receptions. Anquan Boldin is a monster. Don’t underestimate him. He is just as good as Fitz with different skills that compliment each other.
What did Detroit do against you guys defensively? I watched the 49ers game and they mixed stuff up pretty good but I wasn’t able to catch any of your last game. This is a good point about Warner. If he can sniff out where the blitz is coming for at the line he seems to burn it nearly every time.
by packallday555 on Dec 23, 2009 4:28 PM CST up reply actions
The Cardinals LT is out 3-6 weeks, and their o-line has looked awfully suspect against the 49ers and Lions pass rush these past 2 weeks. Hopefully Capers dials up the blitzes, and then we’ll just have to hope for some TOs. I think we also have to hope that the Cowboys lose one more game because I think we’ll lose to the Cardinals, and think the Giants are going to win out. The Giants would have us beat in a tiebreaker, so we have to hold steady with the Cowboys.
by packallday555 on Dec 22, 2009 1:24 PM CST up reply actions
I wouldn’t be so sure with the Giants…
Carolina has been very tough lately and just made the Vikings look TERRIBLE. Its at home which helps, but honestly the Giants are a very beatable team.
Minnesota should still have a lot to play for with Philly and AZ both breathing down their neck for that bye. They only have a one game lead over both of them and you KNOW they are going to be trying to get it…imagine if the Vikings lost that bye…oh would that be sweet!!!
Oh and regarding the Giants and us…right now the tiebreaker would be conference record (since we don’t have a h2h with them)…we are 7-3 and they are 6-4. In fact, we have a tiebreaker right now on BOTH the Giants and Cowboys. Not the Eagles though…
Really?
Someone had previously posted on here that the Giants had a better conference record then we do. I just assumed he was right, and didn’t go and check it out.
That makes me feel much more comfortable, because I think the Cowboys or Giants will lose one more this year. I’m really not all that worried about Seattle, but I just don’t like the Zona’ game. I think we end 10-6 with the first wildcard spot.
by packallday555 on Dec 22, 2009 1:56 PM CST up reply actions
Common opponents
Yes, the Packers have a better conference record now, but that wouldn’t be the case if they fell into a tie with the Giants, in which case the conference record would be the same for both. The 3rd tiebreaker is common opponents and the Giants have an insurmountable lead there.
by uglyfatpimplynerd on Dec 22, 2009 3:16 PM CST up reply actions
Question for you though…it says that tiebreaker is “common games” not common opponents, so I take that as they get credit for ONE win over Dallas and we get credit for ONE loss against MN. Is that right?
http://www.nfl.com/standings/tiebreakingprocedures
As it sits now,
NY beat Dallas, so did GB
NY beat Tampa, we lost
They still play MN (we lost) and we still play AZ (they lost)
If in the process, they lose to MN and we beat AZ, that would make both teams 2-2 in common games. If this is in fact the case (meaning I am interpreting it correctly), it then goes to strength of victory which is incalculable at this point.
Either way, they have a tough road against two teams that are clearly not giving up for the last two games. They have to win one of them and we have to lose one of ours for this to even be a discussion.
That's just poorly worded
It’s the record against common opponents, who are Minnesota, Arizona, Dallas & Tampa Bay.
Opp. Giants Packers
TB 1-0 0-1
AZ 0-1 0-1 (Assuming worst case scenario for Packers)
MN 1-0 0-2 ( see above, but it doesn’t really matter)
Dallas 2-0 1-0
It really doesn’t matter how the wins break down in the last week, with 2 Giant victories against Dallas + their win against Tampa combined with the Packer losses to the Vikings, there is no way the Packers can match the Giants here. Packers need to win out or have the Giants lose another game.
by uglyfatpimplynerd on Dec 22, 2009 4:24 PM CST up reply actions
so much for my formatting...
opp…………………… Giants…………………Packers
TB………………………1-0………………………0-1
AZ………………………0-1………………………0-1
MN……………………..1-0………………………0-2
Dallas………………….2-0………………………1-0
by uglyfatpimplynerd on Dec 22, 2009 4:27 PM CST up reply actions
There’s a solution for this…beat the Seahawks and beat the Cards. I still think its a longshot for the Packers to not make it. The Giants have to be perfect and we have to either lose to a terrible Seahawks team or a team that will likely be on cruise for the final week. I think I like our chances but anything can happen.
Right
Win out and this is not a concern.
by uglyfatpimplynerd on Dec 22, 2009 11:14 PM CST up reply actions
2010 draft
You just know with the way that Ted drafts, we’ll end up with a WR in round 1, an OLB in round 2, and maybe a QB in round 3.
The 2009 draft is starting to look pretty nice though. Reminiscent of the draft that netted Clifton and Tauscher as offensive bookends in the 2nd and 7th rounds, we might have grabbed our defensive bookends in for the next several years in Matthews and Jones (1st and 7th rounds)
Based off of what? He’s actually done a pretty nice job of grabbing need positions in the first round with the exception of the Harrell pickup that one year:
Rodgers
Hawk
Harrell
None (WR in 2nd rd)
Raji/Matthews
Harrell was a confusing one and at the time taking Jordy in 2nd round was a head scratcher, but honestly while we have a good group of WRs, they aren’t as elite as some teams. They are very good though. On top of that, eventually Driver is going to start playing like his age and they need players ready to step in. I think Jordy was a good move and a need position…though not as much of a need as some other places.
If a player that fits a need is out there in the position we are at, he’ll get em…
The Bustin Harrell
experiment isn’t over yet, even. We don’t know if he’s truly a bust. He could switch the beast mode on and come out in 2010 or 11 and perform, we don’t know. All we know is he has potential and talent, along with a high pain tolerance apparently…
Here’s a short article someone else wrote on Harrell and other prospects who were picked after him, and how they match up.
Bleacher Report : Is Justin Harrell a bust?
"I don't know how a guy gets single covered in that situation when you're dropping eight men," Tony Dungy, 12/20/09
by PackaCracka on Dec 22, 2009 10:46 AM CST up reply actions
Harrell
He’s actually the perfect ideal fit for a 3-4 DE in Capers system at what over 6’4" and they said he slimmed down to about 310lbs. He’s in the mold of Aaron Smith and Igor Olshansky but I really don’t have any confidence that he will ever be healthy. I mean it’s been three years now and he’s still on IR.
If one of his doctors told me directly to my face that his back problems were completely gone and would never be an issue again then I might get optimistic but until then I don’t see how I can be. With Jolly’s impending criminal issues and free agency, Harrell would be a nice security blanket but you just can’t pin any hope on him whatsoever.
So disappointing… I’m not mad about the Harrell pick, because after watching the 07’ and 08’ season it was clear we needed another 4-3 DT. What was confusing was that TT decided to go with Harrell..? He was projected by some to go late in the 2nd round!
I’m sure he would be good as a 3-4 DE, I just don’t think he’ll ever be able to get out there.
by packallday555 on Dec 22, 2009 1:35 PM CST up reply actions
eh…just cause some writers had him going that late, doesn’t mean the the GMs did…I’ve heard there were others that were looking at him in the first round.
That makes me feel a little better then. I just remember reading an article after the draft, and reading that Harrell was projected by some as a late 2nd rounder.
by packallday555 on Dec 22, 2009 1:39 PM CST up reply actions
Exactly Right Trevor
Obviously the Harrell pick hasn’t turned out to be a positive but the Thompson haters always use false “facts” to support their opinions on the pick being a bad one (and I’m not directing this at you packallday).
From everything I’ve heard and read, the Broncos were strongly looking at taking Harrell with the very next pick (17th) and more than a few scouts and personnel people were quoted as saying that they thought Harrell had the potential to be the best DT from that entire draft, including Amobi Okoye who went 10th. They said Thompson was looking at trading back into the 20’s but he was under the impression that Harrell would be gone by then so he didn’t want to chance it.
Harrell has definitely been a disappointment but those who keep saying that he wouldn’t have went until the end of the 2nd or 3rd round are full of it. He would’ve lasted into the early 20’s at the latest. Harrell’s lack of notoriety is just a reason for haters to go after Thompson and make stuff up.
Shanahan
I don’t think it’s much of an argument to say that Shanahan was after Harrell. As with Shermie, part of the reason he was replaced was because of his drafting.
by uglyfatpimplynerd on Dec 22, 2009 5:25 PM CST up reply actions
That article is from before the 2008 season so its hard to even really look at it as something to consider. Whats interesting is that with Harrell, its not even the same injury over and over so you can’t say they should have avoided him cause the injury would be recurring or something…its just one injury after another.
You really can’t count on him, but another thing to consider. I can think of another current Packer that had an injury prone label placed on him before he was able to have the chance to shine…know who I am thinking of?
Aaron Rodgers
Remember he got injured in every game he played in (it seemed) while Brett was around. We all had him as a guy who couldn’t get through a season and many thought we were in trouble cause he’d be in IR by like week 3. Now here we are almost done with his second season without an injury…he’s shown grit and willingness to play through injuries
True
I was thinking about a guy on the defensive side of the ball.
by packallday555 on Dec 22, 2009 1:53 PM CST up reply actions
Why'd you have to post that link haha?
That’s just straight up depressing. Seeing as how our secondary is a mess, this article is painful to read. Hall is quickly becoming known as one of the elite Cb’s in this league and Ross has been good too. Even Michael Griffin or Reggie Nelson would have been better. I like Bigby, but imagine how much better we’d be with either of those two guys. I don’t normally like to do the “if only we had…” thing but it’s hard not too in this situation. Hopefully we’ll get a guy at Cb who can help us out next year in this coming draft.
by packallday555 on Dec 22, 2009 1:49 PM CST up reply actions
I know
I think about Ross and how good he’d look taking picks back for six points in the Green and Gold
"I don't know how a guy gets single covered in that situation when you're dropping eight men," Tony Dungy, 12/20/09
by PackaCracka on Dec 23, 2009 12:18 AM CST up reply actions
I wanted Reggie Nelson
but I’m glad that didn’t occur. He is probably going to lose his job in Jacksonville.
What?
I guess I don’t agree. TT’s draft this past year was based specifically off of need. He even traded up to get a need, which is something many of us NEVER thought he would do. I think the draft will be filled with o-lineman, cb’s, and hopefully a rb. According to Todd McShay, this draft is actually pretty deep at OT, and with us drafting somewhere around the 21st mark most likely, we should be able to get one.
by packallday555 on Dec 22, 2009 1:32 PM CST up reply actions
To say that the Ravens
lack a “dangerous” wide receiver or tight end is inviting criticism, in my opinion. Those same lists you say the Steelers have three men on, also have D. Mason at thirty-two among WRs and TE Todd Heap, at number fourteen, respectively. While headlines they may not make, dangerous they surely are.
I think we can bounce back and smash the Seahawks, like we did when Brent was around (one of my fav all time games, down two quick scores, only to rally and destroy, in the playoffs no less) but the Cardinals will beat us down. We need some help from the G-men
"I don't know how a guy gets single covered in that situation when you're dropping eight men," Tony Dungy, 12/20/09
I don't think
the Ravens really have dangerous receivers so I’ll open myself up for criticism along with Brandon. Mason right now is what Donald Driver will be in a couple of years even though statistically he’s having a great season (a little less yards than Driver but one more TD).
Todd Heap has slipped considerably the last few seasons and Finley’s stats are just as good right now, which isn’t good, considering Finley missed about four games and Donald Lee was getting more snaps then him to start the season off as well. I’d say 15-20 teams in the league have more dangerous receiving weapons than the Ravens if you take Ray Rice out of the mix.
Also
If Mason is listed at 32nd for WR’s and Heap at 14th for TE’s, that would mean just about every team has a better wideout than Mason and half of the teams have better TE’s than Heap. That doesn’t sound that dangerous to me. P.S. I’m sorry if I sound like I’m picking on your comment, I just agree with Brandon on this one.
In regards to the Cardinals game, I don’t think the Cards have anything to play for so I see a very slim chance that the Packers don’t win that one. The Cards already won the division and it doesn’t look like they have a good shot at moving to the third seed so I think they rest anyone whose dinged up including Old Man Warner. Plus WHEN the Packers beat the Seahawks, if Dallas or the Giants lose next week, the Packers would then have nothing to play for so I could definitely see players like Barnett, Pickett, Clifton and Tauscher not even be on the field in week 17. Let’s hope.
I think Fitz and Warner both sit for that one (injury worries and concussion history) plus there is a good chance we play them the next week and they will want to make sure we don’t take out any of their key guys.
Just think week 17 could have TWO games that are playoff round one matchups…
The list
The list means little since there are so many WRs and TEs and it wasn’t a team ranking, it was an individual ranking so it doesn’t mean every team has a better wide out than D Mason. I don’t think you’re picking on my comment but the Ravens are 13th in overall offensive rankings and 13th in passing offensive rankings. That’s not lacking at all, Ray Rice or not. Granted he leads the team in receptions, but not yardage by a long shot.
Derrick Mason has more catches than any Packer WR. He also has almost as many yards, is on par with us in YPC average, and has more Touchdowns. How is he not dangerous?
One thing the Ravens lack in their WR corps is explosive gains. Way down on that list. Also, the TE, not many big yardage plays. What you do see is a very high first down percentage and top ten in first downs, overall by a tight end. To me, tight ends catching first downs is dangerous. Lots of methodical movement down the field, high percentage plays.
Is grinding out yards considered dangerous? Maybe not. Are Heap and Mason losing a step? I’d say most def. But if I were Flacco I would love passing to these proven veterans just as much as our rookie playmakers, and in my opinion, both are considered “dangerous”
"I don't know how a guy gets single covered in that situation when you're dropping eight men," Tony Dungy, 12/20/09
by PackaCracka on Dec 23, 2009 12:43 AM CST up reply actions
secondary
The secondary needs to be helped out by getting some pressure put on the qb. He can’t sit back all day with all the time in the world. http://maxsportsplus.com
packer wannabe http://maxsportsplus.com
“and also push CB Jarrett Bush off the roster”
Amen. Considering how well LeBeau took advantage of our obvious weaknesses on defense, it does feel like time to think about next year. A fatal flaw like Jarrett Bush (combined with the blindspot the coaches (and GM) seem to have for him), WILL be exposed by good teams in the playoffs. There’s just no doubt about it. Bell actually seems to have some talent, and he seems like a gamer, but…
I don’t know. When it comes to Bush, I feel like Michael Scott talking about Toby the HR guy. “Toby! Just… shut up. You make everything… horrible!” He is just the weakest weak link I’ve ever seen. …well, with the possible exception of Ahmad Carroll. …maybe.
Still, though, all that being said, that was an incredible throw by Ben. We were damn close to winning that game, and had SO many chances throughout the game and on that final drive to win it. So, the season’s not done.
But just know that Jarrett Bush WILL wreck everything. Know that going in.
Agreed
Bell actually had decent coverage on that play (I know he was supposed to be underneath), and looked ok the rest of the game as well. Pat Lee looked good last year when he played and I’m hoping he’ll blossom for us next year as we could certainly use him.
Bush HAS to go. He should have been gone after 07’, 08’, and should be gone after 09’.
by packallday555 on Dec 22, 2009 1:51 PM CST up reply actions
read Butler's column today?
I don’t know if you read the Journal, but according to Butler, Bell should have been inside his man so that he could push him toward Bigby.
by uglyfatpimplynerd on Dec 22, 2009 3:19 PM CST up reply actions
No I didn't
Inside of him like taking away the sideline? Did he talk at all about Bigby? He was in the middle of the endzone, and looked like he was way out of position to me.
by packallday555 on Dec 22, 2009 4:36 PM CST up reply actions
Yup
Bell’s two responsibilities were to #1 keep Wallace inside of him, and #2 keep Wallace behind him. He blew both responsibilities by letting him get outside of him to the sideline and letting him get in front of him.
If Bell would’ve pushed Wallace into the middle of the field and stayed in front of him, Bigby probably brackets him over the top and Big Ben can’t throw it there. Bell messed up big time.
Damn
That makes sense. I could not get over why Bigby was so far in the middle of the field.
This is just puzzling. From the second Wallace released off the line Bell let him have the sideline. Just makes me wonder if he didn’t know he was supposed to take away the sideline. Because it wasn’t like Wallace forced him to play him on the outside, he just kind of did it.
I miss Al Harris.
by packallday555 on Dec 22, 2009 5:12 PM CST up reply actions
I miss Al Harris.
Tell me about it. I wasn’t crushed when Kampman went down but I had a feeling losing Harris would hurt. Tramon is fine opposite Wood, but Bush is absolutely horrid. If they didn’t put Pat Lee on IR, I don’t think anyone would be talking about this though. Pat Lee to IR was the stupid decision of the year, especially considering Blackmon always is injured and then ended up not surprisingly getting injured.
Pat Lee to IR was the stupid decision of the year, especially considering Blackmon always is injured and then ended up not surprisingly getting injured.
Yes, it was. It’s just a move I didn’t and still don’t get.
Yeah, as sad as it is, I didn’t think losing Kampman would hurt us that much. I thought we might be ok losing Harris but in the back of my mind I knew we could be exploited in the secondary if a team tried too. Surprisingly enough, teams didn’t really try to exploit it until we played Pittsburgh. It’s unfortunate too, because now we’re going to see teams try to do this to us for the rest of the regular season and playoffs.
by packallday555 on Dec 22, 2009 5:30 PM CST up reply actions
Its like we were using a bunch of makeup to cover an unsightly wort on our face,
and one day we forgot to wear the makeup, and everyone laughed at us. From that day forward makeup will not disguise the unsighlty wort because everyone now knows it is there.
Green and Gold / Black and White
Pat Lee, Will Blackmon, and Al Harris
It’s unfortunate that we lost all three of these players to injury. Considering the loss of these three, the “backups” aren’t playing that badly. Hopefully Capers will find a way to mask the defense’s weaknesses and the Packers will figure out a way to gut out some more wins.
A point people seem to be forgetting!!! We are playing w/ our 6th and 7th CB on the field in important positions! How many teams can keep good coverage when you have your nickel and dime CB being the 6th and 7th CB? Not many!!! It sucks, but thats the nature of the NFL, and we have to deal w/ it… It makes our chances in the playoffs remote for this year, but hopefully helps in the future.
Which leads to who wins the SB each year… Usually the team that has been lucky enough to stay HEALTHY all year long. And it IS LUCK!!!
Very true
Injuries, and how teams are able to deal with them, plays a huge role in how successful a teams year can be.
by packallday555 on Dec 23, 2009 12:09 PM CST up reply actions
Missed opportunities
That game should not have ended on the last second. It should have ended when Mason kicked the extra point and even if the Steelers went down and scored and made 2 points we would have won by one, because he missed a field goal in the first quarter! It could have ended on the 3 fumbles that the Steelers had, but the refs were from Pittsburgh I’m assuming because that’s the only way those blind men could whistle those plays dead! Since when is a catch made and you knock it out after he catches it and secures it not a fumble? The stupid illegal contact in the 4th quarter “drive” was a joke. Yeah he got jammed, it may have been a yard deep. I didn’t see one flag being thrown for Hines Ward blowing up AJ Hawk whenever he got a shot at him. Hawk had to have his head on a swivel, that’s why we didn’t get to hear his name much during the game. Al was definitely missed though, even with his propensity to haul off and smack the shit out of a wide receiver now and then, he and Charles are the dynamic duo!
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