Packer Notes: The Offensive Line, The Quarterbacks, and The Hall of Fame
by Brandon on Dec 15, 2010 7:01 AM CST
in Green Bay Packers Analysis
Email
Print
Mike McCarthy admitted that the Green Bay Packers offensive line "lost the battle up front" against the Lions. Is it time to fire the offensive line coach? It's a hard thing to say without breaking down game film and trying to figure how who was supposed to block each defender. Some rankings say the offensive line is the 13th best, and some say 26th at run blocking and 21st in pass protection. If I had to pick on one player, it would be RT Bryan Bulaga, who actually looks more comfortable on the left side. He was awful against the Lions, but in general he's been getting better after struggling in his first couple of starts.
In other differing rankings: Pro Football Focus graded QB Aaron Rodgers ahead of QB Matt Flynn while Football Outsiders had Flynn over Rodgers. The interception shouldn't count against Rodgers and his stats would have clearly been better if WR Greg Jennings had hung onto that long reception instead. That doesn't count on the stat sheet, but it does when deciding who played better.
If you're feeling nostalgic for the Mike Sherman era (who isn't?) then you'll love to read that FB William Henderson and RG Marco Rivera will be inducted into the Green Bay Packers Hall of Fame. Seriously, they were great players until injuries got the best of them. I've never heard of Frank Jonet, but as a history buff (hence the Acme Packing Company site name) it's cool that they nominated someone who worked for the Indian Packing Company and the Packers in 1919.
107 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Mike Sherman nostalgia
Oh how I miss the days when GB had arguably the best running game in football. The embarrassing playoff losses, not so much.
Bulaga wasn't that bad
Honestly, I thought Wells had a much worse game against the Lions. Spitz did too. So did Clifton.
You raise a good point about where Bulaga belongs. He was drafted to play LT, and then the Packers tried him at LG either to light a fire under Colledge or because they thought he might be better. I didn’t like that move — if the guy is your future LT, then play him there and leave him there. The Packers don’t seem to understand that playing the various line positions requires different preparations and techniques, and that you simply can’t have a guard play tackle or vice versa and expect it all to work out the same. When Tauscher got hurt I thought for certain Lang would get his chance (even though I think he’s a LG, not a RT), but I guess Lang was still hurt and wasn’t ready to play, so Bulaga got plugged in sort of because there wasn’t anybody else. Again, I didn’t like that move — LT and RT are entirely different positions, because the former must be a superior pass blocker, while the latter should be able to move piles — because I thought Bulaga should be allowed to focus on playing LT.
I’m starting to think that Bulaga might have a home at RT now. I wouldn’t call him “great,” or even “good” yet, but I think he might develop there. If he does, though, then there isn’t a backup LT on the roster, and if Clifton retires after this season Thompson will have to go and try to find one. LTs aren’t easy to find (particularly for GMs who aren’t very good at evaluating OL talent), and so if Bulaga can play at LT and develop there, then it might make sense to swap him back. Unfortunately for him, that will have had him play 3 of the 5 OL positions. I think that making offensive linemen “generalists,” like Thompson encourages and McCarthy follows, is a bad approach.
What would I do for next year? Here’s what I think I would do:
LT ??
LG Lang
C Spitz or someone new (Wells just isn’t a starting NFL center)
RG Sitton
RT Bulaga
The other option would be to swap Bulaga and ?? at tackles.
I think that making offensive linemen "generalists," like Thompson encourages and McCarthy follows, is a bad approach.
I could not agree more.
Towlieppan: "You wanna throw high?"
"generalists"?
Do you mean making them play multiple spots?
If so, I’d disagree slightly. The trick is to not get people who learned only one spot whereever you got them from. So if a guy is a left tackle in college and ONLY played left tackle, don’t retrain him. He’s stuck that way now.
However, if you draft or trade for people who HAD to play multiple positions, then it’s ok. Great examples on the Patriots roster, Dan Connolly and Sebastian Vollmer. Connolly can play all the interior positions(and FB) and Vollmer can play everything but center. They are very experienced backups and a good fit whereever they go.
Training people when you get them to broaden their approach and skill set is dangerous, wasteful of resources, and can lead to confusion and/or injuries if they aren’t used to it.
They are very experienced backups and a good fit whereever they go.
This I don’t have a problem with. Teams need backups that can play several positions on the line. Let me repeat that: Teams need BACKUPS that can play several positions on the line. My problem with how TT has been constructing the offensive line is that he’s using guys that are average at several positions instead of guys who are good at one position as STARTERS.
Towlieppan: "You wanna throw high?"
To reinforce my point..
Vollmer and Connolly have started all year due to injuries and holdouts. Connolly has shifted from LG to FB to RG in a 2 game or 3 game stretch this season alone. Vollmer is currently RT and has done REALLY REALLY well this year but last year he was the LT, LG, and i think RT toward the end of the year. He has consistently shut down pass rushers no matter where he is, including James Harrison, Robert Mathis, Jared Allen and Dwight Freeney.
Again, my point is that people shouldn’t be retrained for a position because that’s a waste of time and resources. Drafting mediocrity for starters is also a bad idea but given the Packers needs, it couldn’t be helped.
Different positions require different skills
I submit that only backups are “offensive linemen.” Starters, on the other hand, need to focus on one position, because they are all different and require different skills and approaches.
With a traditional right-handed quarterback, the LT is supposed to be able to pass block in space. Generally, defenses put their speed rushers over or outside of the LT, because most teams tend to favor running to the right side (necessitating more size and run-stuffing ability there). Drive blocking for the LT therefore is secondary — the primary attribute is to be able to pass block, alone, in space. They still need to be 300 pounds, and ideally they have long arms. Good LTs are rare, which is why they get paid big money. Clifton in his prime was a very good LT.
The LG does not need to have the same pass blocking skills as the LT (although obviously they are important). Instead, the LG needs to be able to drive block, but some size and strength can be sacrificed at this position because the LG tends to pull on trap plays, and because defenses tend to play their 3 (quick) tackle over the LG. In contrast, the RG tends to be a road grader, a drive-block specialist. As a general matter, the NT will line up on or under the RG, and it is the RG’s job to move or control him (with the center). I could make a snarky remark about how his job might also be to dive at the NT’s knees, but that would show my disgust for the zone blocking system, and hermitcrab would call me a hater again.
The RT needs to be similar to the LG — both need to be able to move in space (the LG to pull and lead screens, the RG to pass block) and still have the ability to drive block. Obviously, pass blocking in space on the right side requires different footwork than pulling on a trap from the left side, but the idea is that these are the “big AND agile” players, although perhaps not as big as the RG or as agile as the LT.
Finally, the center needs to be big enough to handle nose tackles and quick enough to pick off linebackers. They also claim that they are the smartest guy on the line (I was a RG, so I am too dumb to argue with this pronouncement). Wells’ problem is that he just doesn’t have the leverage to hold up against NTs, which is why I liked Spitz better until he got hurt.
The problem with mixing these guys up is that not everybody is suited to play just any offensive line position. Clifton, for example, can’t play RG, nor could Sitton play LT. Even Colledge showed that he can’t move over one spot, and again, this is because these positions are all very different.
Except that
to not do that means carrying 10 offensive linemen (one backup specificly for each position) and making all 10 active on gameday (out of only 45 active spots), at the expense of necessary depth at one or more other positions!
That would mean that more than one fifth of the entire active roster on game day is offensive linemen!
How many teams do that?
To me, that is what would be a “bad approach”.
TT bashers - turning my stomach since 2005!
The glass is way more than half-full!
by NorthStarr on Dec 16, 2010 1:52 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Read that
right after I posted my comment.
But. as you know, you can’t delete or edit your comments, once posted here.
TT bashers - turning my stomach since 2005!
The glass is way more than half-full!
o-line
my prediction for 2010
LT—-cliffy
LG—-lang
C——wells
RG——sitton
RT——tausch
2011 prediction
LT——1st round draft pick/ trade pick for a veteren
LG—-lang
C——-draft pick 2nd/ 3rd round
RG—-sitton
RT—-bulaga
I sure hope that’s what happens. Though even then, we’ll likely endure many growing pains on the offensive line with so many young guys.
by packallday555 on Dec 15, 2010 12:38 PM CST up reply actions
7 years
in a row that the packers will start the season with a different starting 5.
i know——-frustrating, but it is what it is.
Didn't we draft Bulaga
to be a LT… If thats the case then why not put him there where he has been forever and let him play… then get a RT or let Lang have a go at RT and then get a guard
by Goldenarmadillo4 on Dec 15, 2010 3:52 PM CST up reply actions
i don't
think Bulaga has the quickness to be a LT. we also drafted Colledge to be the future LT.
What do you want to do with Clifton then?
He had a good season so far and he signed a 3 year contract extension this past offseason. I understand the idea in putting Bulaga RT, but I think his footwork and experience lines him up better at LT. Also, I like the idea of him punishing the lighter and quicker defensive linemen on the weak side (RE or ROLB). I think that alone will keep the defensive line off balance and puts Bulaga at an advantage in pass protection as well.
"No player is greater than a team."
-Vince Lombardi
Clifton’s problem is that he’s inconsistent in pass blocking. One week, he looks like he’s 28 again and then the next he looks like he’s 35. As far as run blocking goes — he doesn’t have anything left in the tank there. I suppose if we could find a competent LG and C, we could probably find ways to cover for him, but that’s not going to be easy to do.
I don’t know. It’s going to be interesting to see how Thompson goes about fixing the offensive line. I know he’s big on the draft but at this point in his tenure, he should already have a solid offensive line in place. If there’s a guy available in FA or for trade, I think he’s at the point where he has to do it. Otherwise, he’s probably gone at the end of his contract (which I think is 2 more years.).
by packallday555 on Dec 15, 2010 10:22 PM CST up reply actions
I think it's 2 years as well
And that gives us enough time to make the right decision in whether or not McCarthy and TT stay or go. Last year we had an opportunity to solidify our OL, which we took advantage of. This year we will again have another opportunity, so he almost has to do it. It’s all about whether or not he has an opportunity though, which he didn’t have much of an opportunity for a while until 2009 (Oher or Raji).
"No player is greater than a team."
-Vince Lombardi
Agreed. Though, at some point the “not having an opportunity” just isn’t going to suffice. If you can’t get it done through the draft then you need to go about doing so other ways. Now, in fairness, it’s not easy to do other ways with LTs because of their value. But when you look at the inadequacy of Colledge and Wells, there isn’t much of an excuse. Good interior guys can usually be had in the 2nd or 3rd round, and solid FAs are usually available at that position.
I think Buluga will be fine at LT, which should make things easier for Thompson. He should be able to find a solid C and LG/RT, depending on what is done with Lang (who I think needs to be starting next season).
On a side note, it sounds like the Packers really like McDonald. I read a week ago, that some within the organization felt that he could make an impact next season. He’s listed as an OG/C, so I don’t know where exactly they see him. This excites me, and worries me at the same time. On the bright side, it’s good that the coaching staff is excited about him. On the not so bright side, it kind of seems like every one of our guys excites our coaching staff haha. McCarthy also seems to be loyal to a fault at times. It’d be ashame if this McDonald is more of just a hope (like Barbre seemed to be), as opposed to a guy who they really think could be special.
by packallday555 on Dec 15, 2010 11:05 PM CST up reply actions
Gasp!
McDonald was not good in Preseason. IDK what they see in him either, but maybe he progressed as the year went on. You’re right that Center’s are usually less expensive than Tackles and should be easier to find. IDK of any Centers that teams are looking to trade though, I’m not sure who all the Centers are in the draft either (Pouncey is the only one, he’s projected as a 2nd Rounder, but is thought to be a better OG), and I’m not sure how many Centers will be free agents this coming offseason.
"No player is greater than a team."
-Vince Lombardi
they liked Barbre too.
sigh
The only glove he needs is a batting glove. - RWShow on Adam Dunn signing.
by blackoutsox on Dec 16, 2010 12:26 AM CST up reply actions
clifton
only the 1st year(this year) was gauranteed, so just release him.
shake his hand, tell he was a good packer and wish him luck.
hermitcrab, you have a style all your own
Just like Stroh is the king of the exclamation point, you have certainly made your mark with the long dash.
I would do this and swap tackles
I would not mind grabbing another Sitton in the fourth and getting a Max Unger center in the first or where there might be one
The only glove he needs is a batting glove. - RWShow on Adam Dunn signing.
The entire Offensive Line played awful
NFL Network showed a play where Ndamakong Suh lined up outside by Bulaga. Suh bull rushed Bulaga right into Flynn. Everybody, including Clifton was bad. Spitz’s disaster at LG makes me worried about any future at Center, but I would prefer him over Wells at this point. Hopefully we can find a Center in the draft.
2011 Offensive Line if Clifton returns:
LT- Chad Clifton
LG- TJ Lang
C- Jason Spitz or someone in the draft
RG- Josh Sitton
RT- Bryan Bulaga
***Gabe Carimi is drafted in the 1st Round, but sits and learns as long as Clifton is healthy. He cand Marshall Newhouse are our backup OT’s.
2011 if Clifton retires or is cut:
LT- Bulaga
LG- Lang
C- Spitz or draft pick
RG- Sitton
RT- Carimi
Backup OT- Marshall Newhouse
"No player is greater than a team."
-Vince Lombardi
Same. Clifton starting showing signs of decline last season, and it only seems to be worsening this season.
by packallday555 on Dec 15, 2010 10:24 PM CST up reply actions
Clifton and OL
I think Clifton has held up really well this season, Detroit game aside… Other than that he’s played as well as anyone other than Sitton.
As for the rest of the OL, if we have a chance to draft Carimi, or any other OL in the 1st, then by all means! The only place we don’t need someone is RG! We could use another OT, which side matters little!! A LG and Center should be among the higher priorities also. Lang can play LG, IMO, so hopefully thats the direction we go at LG! I just hope he turns out to be as good as everyone thinks he is… I just don’t know if Lang is good enough to be an OT. Would much prefer to get one of those high in the draft!
You've been Stroh'd™!!!
I remember him being shaky in other games, especially at the start. (Philly and Washington come to mind)
I don’t know, maybe I’m being a little harsh because of the fact that he can’t run block whatsoever anymore. It just makes me mad. It makes it hard for us to run to his side, and even to run to the right side because he always seems to let his guy through on the weak side. Though, I think Colledge probably makes him look worse too.
by packallday555 on Dec 15, 2010 11:10 PM CST up reply actions
I loved William Henderson
He was solid for us for a long time
"IF CARDS CAN SIGN SUPPAN THEY CAN GIVE ME A HOME"
by Buddhasillegitimatechild38 on Dec 15, 2010 8:50 AM CST via mobile reply actions 1 recs
Just to bring this up
But the Lions defensive line has been giving EVERYONE problems. It’s not just specific to the Packers. Even the Patriots had trouble with them for a half (and then the blocking schemes got altered and included more TE)
This is an interesting point
because it reveals an instance where a well-coached team made a half-time adjustment to solve a problem from the first half. I really wish our coaching staff was better at doing this.
I don’t want to overshadow the real point that the Lion’s defensive line is really good, even the backups — so it is not a huge surprise that the Packers struggled.
Really, you’d pick Buluga? I’d say Clifton was by far the worst. I’d probably even say Colledge/Spitz and Wells were worse than Buluga too.
Satsunada does make a good point about Detroit’s defensive line. Their sack totals are up quite a bit but it’s still disappointing that we weren’t able to score even one TD.
If you would have told me at that the beginning of the season that we’d have the best scoring defense in the league I would have jumped up and down yelling, “Super Bowl, here we come!!”
by packallday555 on Dec 15, 2010 10:05 AM CST reply actions 1 recs
“If you would have told me at that the beginning of the season that we’d have the best scoring defense in the league I would have jumped up and down yelling, "Super Bowl, here we come!!"
Same here. Unfortunately this has the potential to be the most disappointing winning season ever. And even before the lions game I still was thinking 2 seed and super bowl. Dear Detroit- we’re even.
If you don't know the cadence of GO PACK GO your opinion doesn't matter
--John Jurkovic
What about the wide receivers?
I think it’s wrong to hang the OL completely out to dry. How many of those sacks/QB hits/QB pressures were due to coverage? I can’t believe with the talent we have at WR that no one could get open. Isn’t pass D the Lions’ weakness? If you go as far to say they didn’t have time to get down field, then why could we run shorter routes?
Don’t get me wrong, the OL was pretty bad. We also have to give credit to the Lion’s DL – they are probably one of the top DLs in the league (I’m not looking forward to having to go up against that twice a year now). However, I think the WR play is at least half to blame. Greg Jennings’s dropped potential TD which turned into an INT is the perfect example.
by smileyfacejackson on Dec 15, 2010 10:30 AM CST reply actions
the o line hasn't been any good in 10 years
just like the special teams ,
by Matthew Grassinger on Dec 15, 2010 6:54 PM CST up reply actions
The road against the Giants may have gotten smoother...
They’ve lost Steve Smith for the rest of the year with an injury to his left knee.
http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-giantssmith
WR Rameses Barden has been out since November and is on IR. And ST/LB Clint Sintim has been placed on IR with a torn ACL.
Wisconsin, Big Ten Champions for the first time since 1999...
You'll notice NCAA has no letter for the incompetence within...
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Dec 15, 2010 1:27 PM CST reply actions
Eli or not
if we let them run for 200 yards on us, and Flynn is our QB, it wont matter if we pick him off 10 times
Plus, living in NY, I get to watch all the G-men games, and Eli can turn on the awsomeness from time to time.
by packattack76 on Dec 15, 2010 2:27 PM CST up reply actions
Eli Manning did this, I might point out...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w1M2NnVXZMc
And this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FDcvQ4PRP4k
AND THIS:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9LoV0oUB-7k
And THIS:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0aYAhmXZa-8
Wisconsin, Big Ten Champions for the first time since 1999...
You'll notice NCAA has no letter for the incompetence within...
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Dec 15, 2010 4:18 PM CST up reply actions
Not worried.
Manning can COMPLETELY FAIL as a QB.
If the same Eli Manning who showed up against the Titans, Eagles, and 2nd Cowboys game shows up, it gets a heck of a lot easier for the Packers.
Offensive production is a MUST HAVE.
Wisconsin, Big Ten Champions for the first time since 1999...
You'll notice NCAA has no letter for the incompetence within...
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Dec 15, 2010 3:51 PM CST up reply actions
O-line woes
The whole long thread about “Generalists” has some merit, but only for backups I believe. Considering that Lang, Bulaga, Sitton and Spitz (arguably our future O-line) have all played different positions on a poor offensive line is harming their development. Its great to have young guys play everywhere when you have an established and good offensive line like NE has. Our guys are always hurt and performing poorly, so we dont have that luxury.
The credit given to the Lions DL is well deserved, but the fact that they beat us up and down the line, every darn play is the issue. If Suh beats your G’s once in a while, a player like that is expected to, but to witness a jailbreak each play is just sad.
In terms of our future O-line, this is what I would like to see
LT – Bulaga (we drafted him for this)
LG – Lang (we need something better than Colledge)
C – Wells/Spitz (Wells is getting up there in age, and after a 2nd season of recovery, Spitz might be ready againg)
RG – Sitton (Not have a terrible year in all honesty)
RT – Carimi (Yeah, the Wisconsin Badger guy. Draft him early trade up, I dont care. He is the only NFL ready linemen I feel coming out of the draft)
Clifton (althought my number throughout my playing career was because of him lol) is to old, hurt to often and cannot run block anymore. Time to move on. Tauscher gets hurt whenever someone looks at him wrong, and although he plays very solid, 3 or 4 games is not worth it anymore. Colledge…. yeah. The rest of our backups are not NFL quality players, and I let the blame fall on TT. He may be great at finding value up and down the roster, but sometimes you need to target an area and get it working.
O-line
packattack76 – If Pack got Carimi he’d be the LT. It’s not going to happen though. Bulaga will be the LT as soon as moving him there will improve the line. I would think that Thompson will be looking to shore up the o-line and RB positions in the off season. He has drafted a lot of mid-round G’s over the past few years, but so far Sitton is the only one I see as solid. He has done a great job drafting the rest of the team though. Hopefully in the future they can avoid the rash of injuries that have plagued them this season.
I've made this point before
But RB is at best a distant third in offseason priorities behind offensive line and OLB. I’m also holding out hope that Lang turns into a solid player, but jerking him all over the line is going to hinder his development, and I’m afraid we’ll end up with another marginal player on the line.
Towlieppan: "You wanna throw high?"
I don’t think Carimi would be the LT. He’s a much better run blocker than he is a pass blocker. What ktenreb said above about OL I actually think the Packers could end up getting Carimi. We probably won’t end up picking as late as many of us had hoped we would, and I think he’ll fall kind of like Buluga did, due to looking more like a RT in the NFL. And I know RT’s usually tend to go later but at this point, I wouldn’t care if we had the 10th pick and Thompson took him there. We need an offensive line bad.
by packallday555 on Dec 15, 2010 4:05 PM CST up reply actions
Carimi's a great run blocker and a very good pass blocker
but I can seriously see him falling to the Packers, wherever we end up drafting, and that’s because a whole bunch of teams are going to convince themselves they have other needs than Tackle. Despite the fact that Buffalo’s offensive line sucks. Despite the fact that Bryant McKinnie is complete garbage. Despite the fact that, with an offensive line, Matt Stafford would likely be healthy this year. Despite the fact that whoever the Bears have at RT is a joke. Despit- you get the picture, I hope.
Wisconsin, Big Ten Champions for the first time since 1999...
You'll notice NCAA has no letter for the incompetence within...
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Dec 15, 2010 5:51 PM CST up reply actions
College
In college Carimi is a good pass blocker. In the NFL most of the scouting things i’ve read on him say he doesn’t have the feet to play LT… I tend to agree. Don’t get me wrong, he can probably play LT OK, but I think he would be a Great RT! If I have him and Bulaga, Bulaga is the LT and Carimi is the RT!
I also happen to think that becuz of this he has a chance to fall outside the top 15+ picks and the Packers may have a chance to draft him!
You've been Stroh'd™!!!
I agree. I think Bulaga at LT and Lang at LG may start a new kind of trend in a way...
Both Bulaga and Carimi may only end up as average pass blockers in the NFL too, but if they have superior blocking abilities, that will significantly help them. Think about this:
What does every NFL team have in common when it comes to the NFL? The right side features their best run blockers, the left side features the best pass blockers. The defense matches that: the left side has the best run stoppers, and the right side has the best pass rushers. There are few RE’s and ROLB’s that excell at both run stopping and pass rushing. A lot of times, it’s superior pass rushing abilities and ok run stopping abilities.
Here’s my idea and why I want Bulaga at LT so badly: Bulaga is either an average or good pass blocker (we are still unsure yet as he’s not at LT right now) and is a very good run blocker. If you line him up at LT, you are putting him against lighter defensive linemen or linebackers. Essentially, the guys that are ready to pass rush on most plays. That backfires a lot against good run blocking LT’s in the league. Osi Umenyiora and Jared Allen are examples of this. They are in full pass rush mode, but when the offense runs in their direction, they are completely caught off guard. This tends to keep the RE’s on their heels as well as the game goes on. That gives Bulaga an extra half second or so to get himself established when called upon to pass block. An example of this is RE Tyson Clabo vs LOLB Clay Matthews in our game against Atlanta. Clabo is a run blocking beast, but is a below average pass protector. His ability to run block kept Clay on his heels all game, and that worked against Clay when it came to pass rushing. Yes, I know Clay is playing injured, but he is still effective and was taken out by a below average blocker in 1 on 1 matchups, not double teams or chips. This is how our OL can overcome the pass blocking issues. I think this could potentially start a new trend in the NFL. It goes away from what every NFL does right now, yet keeps our strong side the same if not better with Gabe Carimi.
"No player is greater than a team."
-Vince Lombardi
Don't know if this frustrates anyone else...
but it’s like the Bears have played a completely different schedule than the Packers. They play the Tyler Thigpen lead dolphins (3rd stringer), looks like they’ll draw Patrick Ramsey outdoors in mpls (not even a 3rd stringer). they don’t have to play favre in the dome… bla bla… They also were totally gifted their wk 1 W. And now a solid team like the packers or the bucs is gonna watch some crap ass nfc west team host a playoff game. Just a frustrating season, breaks have been tough to come by.
by ctxsix on Dec 15, 2010 4:35 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
Doesnt frusterate me at all
You can only play the team across from you and we still had every chance to take the division and we dropped the ball (literally if your name is Greg Jennings).
I’m frustrated by the fact that we couldn’t get our own business taken care… what everyone else does is completely irrelevant IMO.
by Goldenarmadillo4 on Dec 15, 2010 5:28 PM CST up reply actions
literally if your name's James Jones, too.
Or one of the 18 morons who committed a penalty…
Wisconsin, Big Ten Champions for the first time since 1999...
You'll notice NCAA has no letter for the incompetence within...
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Dec 15, 2010 5:48 PM CST up reply actions
Please refer to Mark Tauscher specifically
he was humiliated in that game and the game before against Philly.
"No player is greater than a team."
-Vince Lombardi
How many assholes we got on this team anyhow?
I knew it, I’m surrounded by assholes…
Wisconsin, Big Ten Champions for the first time since 1999...
You'll notice NCAA has no letter for the incompetence within...
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Dec 15, 2010 11:21 PM CST up reply actions
Maybe i'm just tired, but i didn't see how that reply fits this discussion...
It’s one of the best lines in Space Balls though!!!!!!!
"No player is greater than a team."
-Vince Lombardi
What's the matter Colonel Danwood?
Wisconsin, Big Ten Champions for the first time since 1999...
You'll notice NCAA has no letter for the incompetence within...
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Dec 16, 2010 6:06 PM CST up reply actions
I didn't see most of the Philly game
how many times did Rodgers get hit as he handed the ball off?
Wisconsin, Big Ten Champions for the first time since 1999...
You'll notice NCAA has no letter for the incompetence within...
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Dec 15, 2010 11:27 PM CST up reply actions
It was mostly in the 1st Quarter
And it was quite often in that quarter!!!!
"No player is greater than a team."
-Vince Lombardi
Oh noes!!!
I’ve been Stroh’d!!™ by Jabooty!!!
Wisconsin, Big Ten Champions for the first time since 1999...
You'll notice NCAA has no letter for the incompetence within...
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Dec 15, 2010 11:30 PM CST up reply actions
Remember, your off the record here
You don’t have to speak in coach speak.
"Tragedy is what happens to me. Comedy is what happens to you." -Mel Brooks
by jobe on Dec 15, 2010 5:58 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
how many games did jennings win for us
he has one shitty game and 44 other guys can’t come out with 5 point’s. No 6 and 10 team should host a playoff gamethe system is flawed, it just hasn’t been exposed until now.
by Matthew Grassinger on Dec 15, 2010 6:50 PM CST up reply actions
Meh
I still support the current playoff setup. I think it makes the playoffs more fun to watch. The winners of each division get in. It sucks in a way when it comes to better teams missing out, but on the contrary you can get interesting storylines out of it i guess. As in, it’s the east coast team vs the west coast team. idk, i just like this setup regardless of the records. That’s just me…
"No player is greater than a team."
-Vince Lombardi
I agree that scrapping the division winners thing would be a bad idea
But maybe something like “You need to at least be 8-8 to get that guaranteed spot” should be added into the rules.
Because there will always be teams like the Cardinals during the Super Bowl run, who get in at 9-7 but actually are a good team on a roll, and make it interesting. But when you’re talking about a team that is 7-9 or lower……..that’s just not a team that deserves a spot in any way.
I think that
the only change to the current system that I would consider would be as follows:
The teams that actually get in would still be determined the way they are currently, with the four division winners (regardless of their records) plus the two wild card teams.
Once the playoff teams are determined, they then get seeded by record, regardless of their status as division winners or wild card teams.
TT bashers - turning my stomach since 2005!
The glass is way more than half-full!
That'd be one heck of a cinderella story though, eh?
A 7-9 team goes on to win the Superbowl. LOL. Such crap, yet, so dramatic too. haha.
"No player is greater than a team."
-Vince Lombardi
There are 3 spots (Division + 2 wild cards)
If you can’t make it, you need only look in the mirror to see what the problem was.
'TAAAAAAANNNK!!!' - Any of Francis, Louis, Bill, or Zoey
Doesn't bother me
The Pears will probably win the division and be one-and-done in the playoffs. The good news there is that Lovie keeps his job for another year, we get an earlier draft choice (yeah, I’d rather draft last in the first round, but oh well), and they’ll get the harder schedule next year.
Yeah it’s not much, but thinking like that keeps me from drinking heavily during the season…
A small damper on your consolatory reasoning
they’ll get the harder schedule next year.
The days of a team’s divisional standing in one year making a significant difference in said team’s schedule difficulty the next are long behind us.
In 2002, when the expansion Houston Texans upped the number of teams in the NFL to 32, the scheduling format was changed to its current one, wherein all four teams in any given division play 14 common opponents; only two games on each team’s schedule are now determined by the previous season’s standings.
Yes, they would get a harder schedule next year, but the difference would be small enough as to be insignificant.
TT bashers - turning my stomach since 2005!
The glass is way more than half-full!
I disagree
The difference in records this year was the difference between playing the Atlanta Falcons vs the Carolina Panthers… that’s easily a 1 game swing just because we played better then them last year… and at this point… that 1 game may be the difference between the playoffs and not
by Goldenarmadillo4 on Dec 16, 2010 4:34 AM CST up reply actions
It's easy enough to hand pick one example, but
generally speaking, looking at the bigger picture, I stand by what I said.
Just saying that, during the 1980s and ’90s, the correlation between standing and schedule difficulty was much stronger than it is now, and it got a reputation that refuses to die, even though it now far exceeds the reality.
TT bashers - turning my stomach since 2005!
The glass is way more than half-full!
So thats my problem!
I usually drink alot less between football seasons! I guess I have to continue to be a good drunk all year round now!!! LOL
You've been Stroh'd™!!!
That's the Bears luck for ya!
Don’t worry, they’ll be one and done and destroyed in the Wild Card game. They are not that good of a team. Don’t forget, they played Philly in CHICAGO and Philly was missing BOTH of its starting CB’s. The only team they played with their head on right and healthy were the Patriots, and they were destroyed IN CHICAGO! It doesn’t really bother me at this point as I know we’re gonna win the division next year. I’m essentially declaring it a lock as our team will be healthy again and half the roster won’t be on IR again…i hope….
"No player is greater than a team."
-Vince Lombardi
Or,
they’ll be one and done and destroyed in the Divisional Round, since two of the three non-West division winners will get a first round bye.
TT bashers - turning my stomach since 2005!
The glass is way more than half-full!
yeah
da bears have led a charmed life this yr. so far, but give them credit, they took advantage. We played a 3rd string qb and got beat.
y are OLmen cutting LBs
wtf run that bitch over college
by Matthew Grassinger on Dec 15, 2010 7:02 PM CST reply actions
your name sounds familiar
I thought you were banned?
The only glove he needs is a batting glove. - RWShow on Adam Dunn signing.
As far as I know,
Brandon doesn’t ban folks. :)
TT bashers - turning my stomach since 2005!
The glass is way more than half-full!
If you want to get banned
To get banned you need to go to the SB Nation Brewers blog and say something that offends the creepy little political wannabe editor or any of the four people who participate. They are easily offended. But don’t waste your time, it’s a joke of a site.
Or, take your chances over at DN, haha.
TT bashers - turning my stomach since 2005!
The glass is way more than half-full!
That's very brave of you to criticize a specific blog on a different blog
But yeah, I know, “I’m one of the five.” Keep telling yourself that.
Towlieppan: "You wanna throw high?"
I can't do it on the other one
I got banned. Said something about a creepy little bald political wannabe from Iowa, and BAM, I’m permanently banned.
Think you could put in a good word for me to get me reinstated?
Good for Bogey!
William Henderson was the motor that made our running game work for years. Glad to see him get some recognition for that.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
And, of course,
twice an hour that I’m not a Bares fan. LOL
TT bashers - turning my stomach since 2005!
The glass is way more than half-full!
by NorthStarr on Dec 16, 2010 3:28 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Line is offensive
The offensive line is by far the worst unit on the team. The run blocking is terrible and some of it is probably scheme related. And the pass blocking is not very good either.
The Lions were getting pressure with 4 guys rushing, which meant everyone was covered. The Giants are going to do the same thing. I don’t know what the answer is, but I think there needs to be some overhaul of players, coaches or scheme where the o-line is concerned.
Scheme related?
I understand that nobody like the zbs, but is works pretty well in Houston where they have the leading rusher in the NFL!!! Arian Foster isn’t complaining about the zbs… And Houstons OL is smaller then the Packers! Smallest in the NFL as a matter of fact! I had come to the conclusion it had to do w/ the OT (Clifton and Tuashcer) that were the problem, but I am now thinking it is the OL coaching! Neither of the OL coaches played in the zbs, they had to learn it from someone else (the former OC who’s name escapes me). If they are going to continue to use the zbs, they need to hire someone who knows it more intimately and how to coach it more effectively!!!
You've been Stroh'd™!!!
Good point
The ZBS has worked in the past with teams like Denver and Atlanta, so I don’t doubt that its viable, but the Packers running game is craptastic, so a) the coaching is not working, or b) the players cannot execute it.
I think Alex Gibbs who was a line coach in Denver and then an OC coordinator in Atlanta taught the scheme to Jeff Jagodnzinski, who coached in GB for just a year before going to Boston College. He handed the ZBS off to Philbin in 2007.
The zbs is used alot now...
ALmost as many as half the teams use it as their base blocking scheme! And its been very successful in some of those places! Very Successful… Yeah Jags was the guy I was thinking of!
Houston, Denver and Atl are teams that have used it to lead the league in rushing so its not like it can’t work very well!!! Clifton and Tausch at their best were not good fits for it. Certainly at this point they are less than ideal, but were such prolific pass blockers that we had to keep them! With younger guys just coming into the NFL, like Sitton, Bulaga, Lang, and holdovers Colledge and Spitz drafted to play in ths zbs it should be working better but its not, and seems to be getting worse not better! Don’t know who, but for gods sake find someone who can coach it the way its supposed to work!!!
You've been Stroh'd™!!!
What those three teams have in common is each of them had Alex Gibbs, the architect on their staff to coach it. It would be like Capers leaving and have someone else take over his defense and then that person leaving it to someone else.
FWIW Alex Gibbs is not working after leaving the Seahawks before the season started.
Was Gibbs in Houston?
I know about Atl and Den, but don’t remember him in Houston! Gibbs is the best and has been for awile at teaching the zbs. If we still had Jags, hopefully he would have it playing better! I still think part of the problem, along w/ coaching, was the OT… Clifton and Tausch were ill-suited for it… Hopefully we get another OT that can play it and get it going! Though Carimi isn’t suited for it very well in the NFL. I know the Badgers do zone blocking too, but it seems a different brand of it in college than the NFL! Precision movement by the OL is the key to the zbs… EVERYTHING has to be perfectly synchronized for it to work well. If its not gap allow penetration and the resulting loss of yardage!
You've been Stroh'd™!!!
Spelling ain't an issue,
since seal is spelled the same in both usages.
And, did you mean a seal here, playing left tackle, and a seal here, at RT, for better execution of the ZBS? LOL
TT bashers - turning my stomach since 2005!
The glass is way more than half-full!
Those are called homonyms, BTW.
TT bashers - turning my stomach since 2005!
The glass is way more than half-full!
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
Related FanPosts on Acme Packing Company
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
SBNation.com Recent Stories
In Association With
Shutdown Corner - NFL - Yahoo! Sports
- Erin Andrews reportedly dating ‘Gossip Girl’ actor Chace Crawford, who also happens to be Tony Romo’s brother-in-law
- Madden ’13 will include ‘Tebowing’
- Deep Posts: Winslow not wanted in Tampa Bay?
- Beyond the Shutdown 50: Juron Criner, WR, Oakland Raiders
- Beyond the Shutdown 50: Gino Gradkowski, C/G, Baltimore Ravens
