Start: Who Should Start At Safety Alongside Nick Collins?
by Brandon on Jun 17, 2010 8:00 AM CDT
in Green Bay Packers Analysis
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PrintIt's a lock that FS Nick Collins will start at safety for the Green Bay Packers. I've had little doubt that SS Atari Bigby would start alongside him, but he is the last remaining unsigned free agent and if he doesn't sign before training camp, he might lose the starting job and never be able to earn it back.
His absence allows rookie S Morgan Burnett to play with the 1st team defense. The topic was brought up on the Cheesehead TV blogcast, which is a great show but I do have to complain that Corey was very unstable while holding up his laptop during the interview with ESPN's Jason Wilde and Elmo. I've had a hard time believing a rookie would start on defense, but Collins did start as a rookie, so I'm becoming open to the idea. Who might be the other starting safety?
Bigby. He was in the Top 10 last year according to Pro Football Focus, and I've come to appreciate him. He's not great in coverage, but he does keep everything in front of him and he's a solid tackler. I'd love to see what he could do if he's fully healthy.
Burnett. When I asked Matt Bowen about it, he said that Burnett has ball skills as a playmaker that cannot be taught. He had some questions about him as a tackler in college, so he might be the anti-SS Aaron Rouse, who was a solid tackler but had no ball skills. Maybe the fact that he's the opposite of Rouse makes him even more appealing.
Will Blackmon and Derrick Martin. Both are pretty similar at this point. They are both former cornerbacks who haven't proven much of anything as players on defense, and are coming off of season ending injuries. They might be better suited as contributors on special teams then on defense. I wouldn't be eager to see either start at safety next season.
Charlie Peprah. After a one-year stint with the Falcons, Peprah returns in 2010 to provide some depth. He was never given a chance on defense, so he (again) might be here more for his play on special teams then anything he could contribute on defense.
Khalil Jones and Anthony Levine. The two undrafted free agents are likely competing for a spot on the practice squad, not the starting lineup. Jones may have a tougher battle since he was originally signed as a WR in 2009.
That's 7 potential players for one starting position, but it's rather thin at the top in terms of starting experience and high draft expectations.
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I picked Burnett
but ONLY cause I WANT him to beat out Bigby for the job. If he’s not up to snuff leave Bigby back there.
Your missing the obvious
As a long suffering Lion’s fan, I truly think you’re missing the obvious.
Albert Hanesworth is so available, it’s sick!
Expectations don't produce!
I think
He’s thinking for Detroit… Haynesworth played for Schwartz in Tenn, so maybe Detroit would trade for him. Haynesworth for Williams and a 1st rd pick maybe?!
2 ballhawking Safeties + 1 ballhawking Cornerback =
A Recipe for SUCCESS!!!!!
"No player is greater than a team."
-Vince Lombardi
I voted for Burnett too, but, realistically, a veteran missing OTAs means nothing. No jobs are even close to decided yet. If Bigby starts missing pre-season games, then we might be talking about something, but…
The poster talked about when Bigby’s “fully healthy.” You’ve got to go all the way back to ‘07 for that. He’s slowed down after that ankle injury. At what point do you say it’s permanent and move on?
…really surprised Bigby hasn’t signed. He makes $3.7 million per year. Doesn’t he see that he’s lucky to be making that much at this point?
It will be 1.7 this year
"I agree but dont agree"
by juggernaut400 on Jun 17, 2010 1:42 PM CDT up reply actions
Oh yeah, sorry
Okay, 1.7 might be a little low for his value. I’d say it’s about right, though. Especially considering the availability problems he’s had.
by Curly Lambeau on Jun 17, 2010 2:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Bigby
I went w/ Bigby… As noted in the post, Bigby is alot better then people give him credit for. While his playmaking hasn’t lived up to what he accomplished at the end of 07, he is still decent in coverage, plays his responsibilities very well, and is a very good tackler! Bigby is just going to play to his responsibilities, be assignment-sure and make all the tackles… IF Burnett wins the starting job, then so be it, but Bigby isn’t going to just lay down and let him have it, and it’ll take major effort on Burnetts part to be anywhere near as sure of his responsibilities and tackling ability as Bigby!!!
Bigby should be the starter unless Burnett plays absolutely lights out AND is a very vocal communicator and calls the right plays!!!
So far he IS just laying down and letting him take it! haha
Honestly Bigby, if he is AT ALL smart, gets his butt in there asap. As long as he isn’t there, Burnett is getting his chance to shine with the first team. If Bigby shows up, Burnett is suddenly wiht the second team and then you have to take his accomplishments with a grain of salt.
Bigby has show his potential for one season but he’s given two mediocre seasons isnce then and I am starting to wonder if he is one of those guys that has a penchant for injury. I actuallly think Bigby isn’t as good as some give him credit for. He’s still riding the momentum of his one good season…I want to see more of THAT.
Its OTA's
Bigby is doing himself any favors missing it and giving Burnett all the reps, but its not like Bigby doesn’t already know the Defense!!!
Bigby doen’t get beat over the top on deep routes and he’s a very sure tackler!!! THose are the 2 most important traits of a good Saffety!!!
I have to disagree about Bigby… I don’t really think he been put in a position to do what he does best… IMO, Bigby is best when allowed to play moving forward in the run game and being active. He’s being asked to play his responsibilities and stay deep all the time.
Yeah you have a point there… but your last paragraph tells me that maybe its just not the right kind of D for him which puts him at a disadvantage.
Best case scenario, Burnett looks GREAT but Bigby looks really good too and then we get a nice draft pick from Bigby! :-) If not this year, maybe next. If Burnett takes his job, I can’t see Bigby happy on the bench.
best case
My best case scenario would be for Bigby to win the job and play really well, while Burnett gets to learn the D and the NFL, but also makes plays in limited opportunities!!! IF that happens, the Packers know they have the next starter besides Collins on the team, and can trade Bigby for a draft pick, or he signs a good contract and the Packers get a good compensatory pick for him… Getting a 4th rd pick for an undrafrafted FA along w/ 3 or 4 years of solid Safety play would be sweeeet!!!!
I have to disagree about Bigby… I don’t really think he been put in a position to do what he does best… IMO, Bigby is best when allowed to play moving forward in the run game and being active. He’s being asked to play his responsibilities and stay deep all the time.
I agree 100% with this. He’s much better when he is allowed to roam free. The problem is, in this defense, I don’t think he’ll ever be allowed to do so. Maybe he isn’t really a great fit for what we’re trying to do on defense. I
by packallday555 on Jun 17, 2010 2:05 PM CDT up reply actions
so far bigby is just laying down and letting him have it. I think that bigby thinks he is worth alot more then he is. I mean yes he is a good safety but he is injury prone and burnett i think will be an amazing safety and having 2 ball hawking safties plus tramon woodson and harris if your a qb you better hope your dead on with your throws or the ball is going our way.
by Adam Tarasievich on Jun 19, 2010 12:10 AM CDT up reply actions
Sitting pretty
This is a tough question because both have question marks and both have serious positives. Bigby’s health is a concern, but he is a solid starter. Burnett is inexperienced and we don’t know what he will look like in pads. If both workout well then the Pack will easily have the deepest group of safeties in the NFCN and should be fine whoever we start.
I admit I voted Burnett because I’m enamored with his upside. In the end let them play it out in camp and see what each brings when the pads go on. Can Bigby get his ankle right? Can Burnett have the same nose for the ball when the speed of the game goes up or the bullets become live? These are questions will be answered through camp and the first few preseason games and then we can answer this question a bit better.
Burnett looking good at OTA's
I know it’s only OTA’s, but Burnett is getting excellent reviews from players and coaches.
burnett
I see him as a young ed reed, I know. its a big leap. but reed had the same things said about him, and what has he done. If we put burnett and collins back there with woodson. It will give alot of room for error with the other CB. they can back people up, and make big plays. that is what lead the Ravens to a SB a few years back, with no offense other then a running back. I think GB’s offense is a little better then the Ravens from that year. It could be special. I want to see GB go all in, and try to win it all.
Reed
That is asking ALOT of Burnett!!! He has some playmaking ability, no doubt about that, but he has to prove to be valuable and assignment sure in coverage and that he is a very sure tackler to ever get even close to Ed Reed… Collins is all those things, but nobody ever compares him to Reed!!! Lets keep it under control a little please…
+1 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
"No player is greater than a team."
-Vince Lombardi
wow
all the packers players and recent draft picks have been great. we just came off our 5th consecutive super bowl victory.
this blog is predictable, anytime someone posts about a packer player either a starter or a recent drafted player that made the team———it’s thesame story. “he’s a playmaker, he has potential and he’s going to be very good.” with all of these great players we have, it’s a shame we haven’t won more games. damn coaching.
bigby is an average safety at best, couldn’t cover me in a phonebooth. good tackler and assignment sure? great another aj hawk, yep that’s what that defense needs. instead of giving up the bomb for 6, he’ll just give up a 15-20 yard dig route at a consistent basis.
it’s thesame story. "he’s a playmaker, he has potential and he’s going to be very good." with all of these great players we have, it’s a shame we haven’t won more games. damn coaching.
I’ve got news for you, that’s how almost any teams blog is. The Vikings blog had an 100 comment thread on their 6th round pick Joe Webb, who is basically at this point an athlete. They had a poll, and the majority of the votes were he’d be the next Qb or lining up next to Rice as the second starter in a few years.
Fans are going to be optimistic about their players, especially when the coaching staff appears to be.
Agreed on Bigby though. Which is why I’m praying that Burnett lives up to his potential, or at least can be good in coverage, which is supposed to be his major strength.
by packallday555 on Jun 17, 2010 7:14 PM CDT up reply actions 4 recs
Oh sorry.
What a terrible draft. The GM is clearly an idiot. None of these guys have ANY potential on top of that the team has no real playmakers I can’t see us doing well for at least another decade. Terrible coaching along with a team of terrible players will doom us all. woh is me…
Bigby should start
but I voted for Burnett because no way Bigby stays healthy past the first quarter
something tells me even the mafia wouldn't call on greg walker if a hit was needed.
-MarketMaker
Wow – Packer fans are in for a RUDE awakening this year.
Do you NOT realize that the pass defense, except for woodson, was horrible last year?
Do you NOT realize that TT did nothing to improve it, except for drafting a S in the 3rd round
Do you NOT realize that the LBs, with the exception of Matthews, all suck???
Except for Romo, any decent QB they faced last year ate them up!!
TT is either too arrogant or ignorant to accept that FA is a MAJOR part of how NFL teams do business & improve – I’m not saying he should go nuts and sign all the FAs available, but it’s comical how much he ignores it. Ironically, his big FA acquisitions [pickett, woodson] have been great additions.
I forsee the 2nd coming of the Lynn Dickey era – very good offense, very bad defense – and who knows about special teams.
and BTW – I’m a packer fan.
Do you NOT realize that the pass defense, except for woodson, was horrible last year?
I think a lot of us realize that, and also realize that if some guys don’t step up it will likely struggle again. It should improve simply by virtue of more experience/understanding of the schemes, and by getting some players back from injuries/guys hopefully improving (Underwood, Lee, and Williams..). I guess you never know though.
Do you NOT realize that the LBs, with the exception of Matthews, all suck???
Barnett was pretty good, and Jones was solid. Hopefully this is the year Chillar or Bishop officially takes over Hwak’s starting job but that seems pretty unlikely.
TT is either too arrogant or ignorant to accept that FA is a MAJOR part of how NFL teams do business & improve
Arrogance could actually be the answer. He’s a good drafter, and it seems like he is fond of that. I actually thought he would make a move this season in FA (silly me I guess haha). Granted, our two biggest needs, Cb and Olb, were both pretty thin in the FA pool. We’re just going to have to hope that the experience in the new scheme helps, along with players improving (Jones at OLB, possibly Matthews, and Raji), players returning (Lee and Harris), and position adjustments (Raji to NT, which will hopefully lead to more of a push up the middle).
by packallday555 on Jun 17, 2010 7:24 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Building off of what PAD said
On the secondary (outside of Woodson) being horrible:
Don’t forget that Collins was able to put together a Pro Bowl season in his own right. Now I will admit that he didn’t show up in some of our bigger games, but that doesn’t mean he was horrible. Far from it actually. The rest of the horrible secondary I would chalk up to injuries. What I would challenge all those who just chalk up the 2009 Packer secondary woes (especially the Pitt and Arizona games) to name a team that can take three injuries in one position and still be able to put out competent players. This alone doesn’t excuse 500 yards of passing, but really think about that…the Packers were down to fifth or sixth guy on the depth chart. That’s just tough to plan for.
On the LB’s sucking:
PAD said this well, I would just state that there is a large difference between sucking and being good. That’s as big a difference as good and great. CM3 was great last year and the rest of the LB’s were good. They weren’t great, but the hold hard fact of the NFL is that not every player is great.
Finally the TT comment.
Honestly, I think I’m done with this type of comment. I get that TT has his detractors, and that fans want the team to make headlines all year round, but please think this through before you lament the lack of FA’s being brought into Green Bay. Free agency is just not what it used to be anymore, especially this past year. Between the expanded RFA and teams being smarter about who they let enter into the FA pool, there just are not many impact free agents available. Those few impact free agents that do hit the streets do so for a reason, they want too much money.
So here’s my simple request: please, please, please, if you are going to dis TT for not using free agency and call him names as a result, name some specific guys he didn’t go after. Say he’s an idoit for not going after Haynesworth or Chris Canty. Make impassioned please for why Chester Taylor or Dunta Robinson should be in the Green and Gold.
But if you insist upon the veiled and generalized critique the answer will just be the same…teams that tend to last in the NFL don’t really use FA anymore. The teams that dip into FA typically do it because they don’t draft well. These teams flash and disappear. The teams that stay consistent for a long time, see the Colts, Steelers, Pats, Chargers, and Ravens build primarily through the draft. If these teams do dip into free agency or trades it’s because they don’t draft well at that particular position (e.g. Ravens trading for Boldin this past year), but this is an exception, not the rule.
by PackApologist on Jun 18, 2010 12:21 AM CDT up reply actions
I agree. When I saw that comment I was thinking.....
what was the last big name Free Agent that actually did something to make a team win a Superbowl or do big things? Drew Brees and Charles Woodson some 5 years ago or so? Seriously, that’s not a reliable source to win championships. Again, please refer to the successfull teams year in and year out for reference on this. Free Agency is DEFINATELY not what it used to be!
"No player is greater than a team."
-Vince Lombardi
However, I do think their run defense will be good – but unfortunately, todays NFL is a passing league.
It all starts with stopping the run though
We had a good Pass D in 2008, so what happened? Our D simply lost the majority of our games that year. Stop the run first, then build off of that. it is a passing league though, and I agree with you, we should be concerned.
"No player is greater than a team."
-Vince Lombardi
A new scheme, and injuries is what happened. It probably wasn’t easy for a lot of the guys to go from playing almost exclusively man to man, bump n run, to almost exclusively zone coverage. In some games some of the guys just looked lost, really.
by packallday555 on Jun 19, 2010 12:27 AM CDT up reply actions
man
Packers still played the majority of the time in man coverage! It was mixed in w/ some off man, not as much press man. THey didn’t play much zone coverage… Capers said his D could do both and that he would play to the strengths of his players… Woodson, Harris and Williams all have strong man coverage skills… Capers also adapted to what McCarthy wanted, as McCarthy has stated repeatedly that he like man coverage… He likes pressing the WR and putting pressure on the offense. The 34 D can use both…
Exactly
Although the main intention is to eventually get to the zone blitzes, which is when the 3-4 is used best. However, our defense was playing mostly man coverage (at least to what I recall). Don’t get me wrong though, i’d say a good 30-40% of the defensive downs were zone plays. Eventually, it will be changed over though. Just not until we get the right players to do so. While I think Woodson and Nick Collins benefit significantly from zone coverage, guys like Al Harris and Atari Bigby don’t. I think Tramon Williams is better in man to man coverage as well.
"No player is greater than a team."
-Vince Lombardi
I know it can use both, and I know Capers can, I just felt like a saw us running a lot more cover 2 and cover 3 then we ever had before. Maybe going from man to man nearly every play with Sanders, to more zone coverages with Capers made it seem like it was happening a lot more, and honestly, I hope we start to run more zone coverage. Hopefully we’ll see some more this year with more experience in the scheme.
by packallday555 on Jun 19, 2010 1:43 PM CDT up reply actions
coverage
Even w/ the Packers playing mostly man coverage w/ the CB, the Safeties played 2 deep. Mostly the safeties played halves, I think… Its the best way to play man and still keep the deep covered. Just cuz the safeties played 2 deep doesn’t mean its zone coverage.
I don’t think the Packers are going to make the switch to zone. They’ll use it some, but I don’t see it increasing alot. McCarthy has always said he likes to play man, especially Press Man. It was likely something that McCarthy wanted assurance from Capers before the hire.
The 34 D can use man and zone equally well, its just a matter of preference as to which direction it goes. Balt used almost exclusive Press man coverage when they had McCallister and Samari Rolle… Packers have Harris and Woodson, w/ Williams being better in man as well… Woodson is the special player that can play BOTH equally well!!!
Make no mistake…. I love the Pack – and I think TT does a pretty good job of drafting.
But I’d be very curious to see where the Packers rate as far as $$$ spent on FA since TT took over – and who the next cheapest team is.
I mean…. it’s almost mind boggling how won’t spend $$$, considering GB has DEEP pockets.
I don’t doubt you do. They probably rank pretty low, and actually might be the cheapest. I agree with you that he should spend some more $$ in FA. He’s built a pretty darn good core of young players. Sprinkling in some veterans around them certainly wouldn’t hurt.
by packallday555 on Jun 17, 2010 11:53 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't know how deep those pockets are
From what little I’ve paid attention to with the estimation of franchise worth the Pack seems very middle of the road. We aren’t dirt poor like the Vikings and we are printing money like the Cowboys and Redskins.
by PackApologist on Jun 18, 2010 12:24 AM CDT up reply actions
i like
the fact that he’s cheap, that way the packers won’t have to ask the brown county residents to pony up more money.
FA
PackApologist -
I agree with most of what you said. Where I differ is that teams that are close, perhaps a player or two away, from having a very complete team that has deep playoff aspirations are ones that dip into the FA pool. That has very little to do with not drafting well.
The primary reason that I believe TT doesn’t do FA very well is because of the affect on the locker room. If he brought in Julius Peppers for example, you’d have guys and their agents comparing his deal to theirs (almost always unfairly) and suggesting that if he’s worth X, then I’m worth Y.
Where that hurts the team is that you miss veteran leadership. You miss the older guys teaching the younger guys how to be pros, study film, take care of your body, etc. Being the youngest team in the league for the last 4 or 5 years and all the Packers making headlines for non-football related issues is not a coincidence in my opinion.
I would have loved to see a Randy Moss pick up. Think that wouldn’t have made a difference in 06? I would love to see Chillar on the field more. He’s just a more dynamic athlete than Hawk. I think Barnett is solid. I think the jury is out on on Jones.
The problems the packers had against good quarterbacks is that their secondary depth was severely diminished due to injuries. They knew when they gave him an offer that Bush was not a coverage guy. He’s exclusively a special teamer. So, if you’re relying upon him to make plays for you, good luck with that.
Yeah I was going to bring that up about contracts as well, it’s a great point of why TT does not see value in the FA system.
I also get the need for veteran leadership. I think the main reason why we dropped so much in 08 was because of a lack of it. We were missing a huge veteran leader in Farve and Rodgers hadn’t grown into that role yet. Rodgers growing into a leadership role (and a weak schedule) is a main reason for the turn around.
To further strengthen that point all one needs to do is look at the two most successful FA pick up last year, Darren Sharper and Brett Farve. Both of these guys added that veteran presence at key positions. Both of these teams needed that presence and style of player in that system.
But then here comes my question from before again, which FA do we need? The only real area where a FA might help is OLB as far as I can see, and there was not a deep OLB FA pool this year.
by PackApologist on Jun 18, 2010 9:19 AM CDT up reply actions
From the JSOnline sports blog
# Atari Bigby continues to be the only unsigned RFA, which has allowed rookie Morgan Burnett to impress. “I see Burnett as a very natural, instinctive football player. Things come very easy for him. He’s a good communicator. He’s a very fluid player in space. His athletic ability and the instincts, he picks up coaching very well. That was very evident watching him play the wing position in the punt protection. Just like all of our younger players, the biggest transition from college to professional sport is number one, keeping up with the speed of the game, but really the second part that every NFL player that comes into camp for the first time is to get reps. You’re always fighting for reps, and it’s really helped him.”
Thompson knows exactly what he’s doing. Fans tend to mimic the media and do little analysis. The first question was what happened that allowed the “elite” QB’s to eat up the the defense? The second is what have the Packer’s done about it? Before going there, it is obvious that the defense was substantially improved last year.
The problem was the inside rush, especially later in the season. If a QB can stand unmolested in the pocket, he will eat up any team. The overwhelming target area was the middle of the field. ILB and safety territory. We were down to scrubs in the secondary. There was nothing Capers could effectively do. But the DL was NOT doing it’s job in pushing the pocket. Hmmm. Could be why he drafted Neal and moved up to get Burnett.
The fact that it is the second year for the defense and reinforcements have arrived will allow the packages that have a chance to defeat a good QB on his game.
ILB and S
THis is what happened to the Packers D vs the good QB’s… Pitts utilized these types of routes, as they knew the best way to attack Capers Man coverage schemes… I think it had less to do w/ the ILB and S, as it did the route combinations and bunching or WR! The route combinations should look very familiar, with all the crossing routes and the bunching of WR made it difficult for the CB to stay w/ the WR… The bunching of WR took advantage of the Packers being relatively new in the 34 D and not as good communicating as a more experienced 34 D would be! THe Packers still played press man coverage the majority of the time last year! To say it was the ILB and S is way over-generalizing the situtation!!! Here’s the link…
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Inside-the-playbook-defeating-manpressure.html
Pay particular attention to the routes run vs the man coverage in the graph… You’ll see that its not the ILB and Safeties that are being exploited. You can also see the bunched formation used by bringing the WR to the strong side to create a 3 reciever bunched set.
Bunched WR Sets
That was the dagger against Arizona. I recall that clearly. I think a little against Pittsburgh, but I think we were all in shock for the most part to really understand what happened against Pittsburgh. The lack of depth in the secondary surely didn’t help matters either.
"No player is greater than a team."
-Vince Lombardi
Thompson
I don’t think Thompson reacted to those particular games as much as you indicate he did. We definitely needed Safety help as when Bigby went down or wasn’t 100% the safety play suffered alot. And Bigby has shown to be injury-prone… Also the Interior pass rush needed help, but so did the DE w/ Jolly and Jenkins being FA next year, not to mention Jolly’s legal situation!
Favre
You can also take #4 out of the equation when it came to our Pass D… As he only threw for 271 and 244 yds in the 2 games vs the Packers… What made it SEEM alot worse was that it was Favre who did it and the fact that he threw 3 and 4 TD’s vs the Packers. He didn’t put up unusually large passing games vs the Packers D!
This is a good point. It really didn’t help that he literally had all the time in the world to throw either. Any good Qb is going to take advantage of that.
by packallday555 on Jun 19, 2010 12:39 AM CDT up reply actions
The problem was the inside rush, especially later in the season. If a QB can stand unmolested in the pocket, he will eat up any team. The overwhelming target area was the middle of the field. ILB and safety territory. We were down to scrubs in the secondary. There was nothing Capers could effectively do. But the DL was NOT doing it’s job in pushing the pocket. Hmmm. Could be why he drafted Neal and moved up to get Burnett.
Bingo. Favre, Rothlisberger, and Warner repeatedly stepped up in the pocket against us, and pretty consistently torched us up the middle. Pickett and Jolly were a great duo against the run but when it came to passing situations, not so much. Too me, the moving of Raji to NT is almost exclusively in hopes that he will provide more of a pass. Why else would we move Pickett who did a great job last year at NT?
Plus, like you said we drafted Neal, who is supposed to be a quicker DT, who provides more of a pass rush. The drafting of Burnett, who is supposed to be a ballhawk also seems to point to the inability of Bigby/Rouse/Martin/Bush at SS in coverage.
by packallday555 on Jun 19, 2010 12:37 AM CDT up reply actions
A rotation will still be needed though between Raji and Pickett
Pickett is playing out of place at DE, but that’s my opinion. I agree though, Raji will be far better against the pass and perhaps just as good against the run. We just invested so much into Pickett now, that I’d hate to put the D in the worst case scenario.
"No player is greater than a team."
-Vince Lombardi
Yeah, I don’t really know. I mean Pickett is pretty much soley a run stopper, and I think he’s capable of doing that anywhere on the DL. I know he’s big for a De but so was Jolly, and he was still pretty decent for us. Pickett has some quicker feet then you’d think, I think he’ll be just fine at DE.
I think the move really is needed cause like marcopo alluded to above, we got no push up the middle last season. Being able to have a guy who can collapse the pocket more, will really help the OLB’s.
by packallday555 on Jun 19, 2010 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions
the thing is though, Pickett has to be quick enough to bounce to the outside or at least take out the TE. we’ll see though. i haven’t saw that quickness in him yet. however, i’m not there watching him on the field practicing. the coaches know better than i do.
"No player is greater than a team."
-Vince Lombardi
Pickett
I still think Pickett is the primary NT on run downs… I would use Raji some on run downs too, but mostly Pickett and try to conserve Raji’s energy for pass rush!! Pickett may be putting some reps at DE, but I don’t think he’ll play much DE when the games start!!!
THe Packers wanted to make sure Raji gets plenty of reps at NT for development!!! Just like the CB… THey sat Woodson and didn’t mind Williams not being in OTA’s so the young CB could get all the reps… Guys like Underwood, Lee, Bell all benefitted from reps in OTA’s… Same at NT w/ Raji getting the reps at NT and Pickett at DE… When the games are played though, Pickett is a NT, not much of a DE!
It would be a good strategy to have Pickett and Raji switch based on what the Packers think is coming
and they can both stay on the field most of the time
something tells me even the mafia wouldn't call on greg walker if a hit was needed.
-MarketMaker
not according to Raji
"Sky’s the limit for me, I believe," Raji said. "When I come in and wreak havoc, it will change a lot. It makes the lives of Nick (Barnett) and (Brandon Chillar) and A.J. (Hawk) a lot easier. That’s what the 3-4 is designed to do, get our linebackers running free and making plays. And when the opportunity presents itself, I’ll make the plays myself."
I think Raji FULLY intends to be our NT…and I hope he gets it! They aren’t telling him this is for future development…this is for real if you can believe what he’s saying.
http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/article/20100616/PKR01/100616156/1058&located=rss
I read that… Doesn’t really mean alot. I want a rotation of Pickett and Raji. With Raji getting more snaps than Pickett. I said Pickett is the NT on Run downs, which is about 1/3 of the time! I still think conserving his energy so he can be better in the pass rush would be the ideal way to use him. If you use Pickett at DE on another 1/3 of plays he still gets plenty of snaps. IF Jolly plays some DE, assuming he is acquitted. Packers can’t really count on him as of now…
My thinking just has to do w/ not using all Raji all the time and sapping his energy playing every down at NT.
Same, I hope he gets the majority of the snaps at NT. Him providing a push up the middle could help out the defense a lot like he himslef alluded too.
by packallday555 on Jun 20, 2010 6:12 PM CDT up reply actions
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