Where Have All The Backup Tight Ends Gone?
by Brandon on Oct 27, 2011 7:00 PM CDT
in Green Bay Packers Analysis
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PrintQuarless waits his turn - JSOnline. I'm not too worried about the development of Green Bay Packers TE Andrew Quarless. He's only 23 years old, and he's asked primarily to block. But I hadn't thought about how much the Packers have focused exclusively on TE Jermichael Finley.
There are five TEs on the roster, and here are the number of times they've been targeted through the first seven games.
| Player | Targets |
|---|---|
| Finley | 37 |
| Crabtree | 2 |
| Williams | 2 |
| Quarless | 1 |
| Taylor | 0 |
The four backups all have their role, but receiving is not one of them.
I'm not disappointed in any of these guys for not catching more passes this season. There haven't been enough pass attempts to go around. It's good that they've done what the team has asked of them (blocking, special teams) and Quarless, D.J. Williams, and Ryan Taylor have all showed some skills as receivers in the past. Tom Crabtree catches a pass once in a while, but he'll always be primarily asked to block. I don't think any of them are as talented as Finley, but they'll provide options if they do lose Finley as a free agent next year.
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they need to throw to finely more
hes 3 drops away from 3 more touchdowns. that upsides gotta come through soon.
*totally not fantasy biased
NAOPOS
I hope you lose.
That dog just won't hunt.
by Bush League All Star on Oct 27, 2011 9:50 PM CDT up reply actions
Why would you hope that?
I hope Finley catches a lot of TDs.
13.
Grossman: Sup, you insulin needing bitch! The sex cannon has arrived! Now get the hell out of my locker room, you chinless mother fucker!
I hope an army of squirrels.....
pummels BLAS with acorns until he has big red welts all over his face…
but that never happens.
In Every Climb and Place....
by PhoenicianPakFan on Oct 27, 2011 11:06 PM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
I hope people quit taking me serious on APC...
This is twice now. >.<
That dog just won't hunt.
by Bush League All Star on Oct 27, 2011 11:45 PM CDT up reply actions
Sometimes BLAS....
one has to put down the hammer to smoke the peace pipe….
I don’t really know what that means, but it kinda sounds good.
In Every Climb and Place....
by PhoenicianPakFan on Oct 28, 2011 2:06 AM CDT up reply actions
I don't either.
Stay away from drugs, dirty hippie.
That dog just won't hunt.
by Bush League All Star on Oct 28, 2011 12:43 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
But maaaaaaan, there's nothing to do in my dung house....
its not like I need time to wash my hair.
In Every Climb and Place....
by PhoenicianPakFan on Oct 29, 2011 2:23 AM CDT up reply actions
Especially those micro-dots!
"Perfection is not attainable,
but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence."
"It's a great day to be great, baby!"
Skol is a four-letter word.
The Munsters of the Midway still suck!
Personally,
I hadn’t thought about how much the Packers have focused exclusively on TE Jermichael Finley.
I’m surprised they haven’t focused on getting Finley the ball More! I honestly don’t think he’s gotten it enough. Not saying he should be getting it as much as Jennings, but he should be a bigger part of the offense IMO. He’s far too much of a weapon and mismatch to not be more involved. I know teams have paid more attention to him since the 3 TD game, but he should be a more utilized weapon than he’s been. I think its easier to get TE open than it is WR and Jennings is much more a focus as FInley.
As for the other TE’s … None of them are nearly good enough to warrant targets. They just don’t do anything or offer an inviting enough target to get the ball more. DJ Williams might in the future, but certainly not now. They have some development to do before they are worth targets more than they are now.
You've been Stroh'd™!!!
This methodology runs against their stated methods
Every week Rodgers stresses that he throws it to the open receiver, and thankfully there is usually at least one open guy. If Finley is open, he’ll get his targets, but most of McCarthy’s offensive success is because he gameplans for the whole team, not specific players.
by mathgeek99 on Oct 28, 2011 12:28 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
not according to what I've read...
in an article about a month ago or so. McCarthy studies to find out how the Defense plays certain down and distances, then he puts in plays and figures out how the defense will match up w/ that personnel group or situation, after that he takes it a step further and looks for mismatches in how the D will play that personnel grouping or down and distance. It explains why Nelson got 12 targets in the SB. McCarthy knew how the Steelers would line up vs certain plays and he also knew that most of the time Jennings would draw Ike Taylor in man, and Nelson would draw William Gay. So they went into the game knowing that Nelson had the best matchup and did everything they could to manipulate and take advantage of that specific matchup.
If teams are doubling Finley, and the Packers know it or realize it, they will go to other matchups to take advantage of other mismatches. But McCarthy can also put Finley into situations where he will draw single coverage and if the D changes it up, and doubles Finley he then knows the next best matchup and goes in that direction. McCarthy makes it all about the matchups.
You've been Stroh'd™!!!
None of them are nearly good enough to warrant targets
You’re right but I would love to see Quarless get more for no other reason than as a reward for ass-planting Jared Allen.
In Every Climb and Place....
by PhoenicianPakFan on Oct 28, 2011 2:08 AM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Same here. I think a lot of it just has to do with how much teams pay attention to him. Though, you’d think he’d still be seeing more action then he has. And shit, for how high I took him in my fantasy drafts I need him to do better LOL.
Fire Slocum
by packallday555 on Oct 28, 2011 10:32 AM CDT up reply actions
My guess is he’s just not getting as open as the others…
The Green Bay Packers...Putting bad coaches out of their misery since 2010
by TrevorR on Oct 28, 2011 12:09 PM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
Ok, so
Jennings has been targeted 58 times, the most on the team. You’re OK with that.
Who has been targeted 2nd most?
Finley, with 37. He’s getting more targets than the #2 WR, that’s pretty damn good. I think he’s being used appropriately.
by Archibaldcrane on Oct 28, 2011 5:52 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
The rest:
Nelson has 35 targets, Jones has 25, Starks has 24, Driver has 22, Cobb has 13, Grant and Kuhn have 8.
by Archibaldcrane on Oct 28, 2011 5:54 PM CDT up reply actions
Personally
I would like to see Finley up around 45-50. He is the kinda player, who even when he’s covered well in single coverage, he’s still open. He’s got a huge catching radius… Like Nelson, but no way he should be close to Finley in targets. Not saying force him the ball either, but find ways to get him the ball a little more. McCarthy and Finley had that talk and I kinda figured he would see more targets, but he hasn’t been involved as much as I think he should. If teams are double covering him,fine then look elsewhere, but if single you gotta look for him. Jennings is getthing thown to even when he’s covered. No reason Finley shouldn’t either. I would say Jennings and Finley are 1 and 1a, not 1 and 2 w/ Nelson 2a.
You've been Stroh'd™!!!
Maybe Finley should get open more often like his other counterparts and he’d get more balls thrown his way. I don’t want to see Rodgers forcing the ball to anyone, not even Finley.
The Green Bay Packers...Putting bad coaches out of their misery since 2010
Like I said...
Not saying force him the ball either, but find ways to get him the ball a little more.
Directly from my comment. If he’s being doubled then by all means look for single coverage, but if he’s singled and good coverage, he’s open due to his huge catching radius.
You've been Stroh'd™!!!
So why do we have 5 tight ends?
This just makes me more upset that we kept 5 tight ends and didn’t keep WR Chastin West. He was awesome in the preseason and can return too.(not that Cobb is doing a bad job) 4 tight ends have 5 catches…I’m pretty sure West would have that by himself. I know we have great offensive weapons already and it is splitting hairs between a 5th TE and a 6th WR but how often do we have 4 and 5 WR sets compared to 3 or 4 TE sets? Seems like West would have been a lot more valuable.
Tight Ends do more than catch passes
So far Ryan Taylor has done a great job on special teams, Tom Crabtree and Andrew Quarless have a good job in blocking and running situations as well. Williams has even found a way to contribute lining up at H-back as well as FB in some situations.
The reason why the Packers kept all those TE’s is because they are able to do multiple roles. Keeping extra WR’s would be facing an even tougher situation getting on the field than the TE’s right now. The bottom line is that the offense has oodles of weapons to choose from so having guys who are going to be able to perform and contribute in ways that don’t necessarily involve getting the ball in their hands is going to be critical.
by PackApologist on Oct 28, 2011 3:32 PM CDT up reply actions
Can West line up
as a fullback?
"Perfection is not attainable,
but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence."
"It's a great day to be great, baby!"
Skol is a four-letter word.
The Munsters of the Midway still suck!
Because we have one FB
And I’m pretty sure West couldn’t have leveled Jared Allen.
But really, look at how often there’s a TE in the backfield helping block. It’s way more often than we’d need a sixth WR.
Won't feeling so bad losing Finley in the offseason...
We won a championship without him and Quarless is looking like a stud in the making. Wouldn’t mind franchising Finley and getting some scrumptious draft pics for him in a sign and trade. Some team will take a trade for a monster TE/WR hybirid. I’ll take a DJ/Quarless TE combo for the next few years, take some Finley money to lock up Raj/Mathews/re-work Rodgers
by PackFaninFL on Oct 28, 2011 12:46 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
I might be up for it. Honestly Finley is very good, but he’s had 3 years now to make that leap and he just hasn’t. Look at what Graham is doing in New Orleans, that is what Finley should be doing. You take out his one 3 TD game and he’s been mediocre at best this year. sigh…
The Green Bay Packers...Putting bad coaches out of their misery since 2010
true words
Finley has played a couple amazing games, but he also disappears at times. He may eventually live up to his potential, but he hasn’t yet. Even his YPC and YAC are low. Our WRs are explosive, and Finley seems like he should be, but he hasn’t been so far. I have a hard time faulting how Rodgers and MM have used the passing game so far this year.
Would you trade a 10-yard gain to Finley for a 80-yard TD to Nelson?
Maybe Finley needs to be on a team that NEEDS to rely on him for him to really flourish. Clearly he’s just one of our many talented weapons here so he doesn’t stand out like he did a year or two ago before Jordy really stepped up and Jones started actually catching balls. I think last year we learned that we don’t need to make ourselves rely on a TE so now he’s just one of the pieces.
The Green Bay Packers...Putting bad coaches out of their misery since 2010
Paying talent.
Thats what it comes down to… After this year, Grant, Driver and Clifton probably come off the books. Thats about 17M I think. Packers gotta resign Finley and Wells yet. About 10M for them combined. plus we’re about 6M under the cap right now… That still leaves in the area of 13M. Enough to get Rodgers a new contract in the area of 20M and still have some left. When Pickett comes off the books that will be money to spend on Raji, and Matthews will get done at some point in the next 2 years. Packers are in good shape for salary cap purposes. No reason to give a talent like Finley away when his a far superior player to any of the TE’s behind him!
Quarless isn’t nearly ready to play a role similar to Finley and neither is Willims, Quarless is a good in-line TE, but can’t line up outside and command a double team and Williams while a good reciever doesn’t pose the matchup problems that Finley does w/ his size and athleticism. Both are huge downgrades from Finley!
You've been Stroh'd™!!!
Not so sure
It all depends upon what Finley is asking for. If he is asking to be the highest paid TE in the NFL, he’s gone.
I’m also not so sure that Finley is a far superior player to what Quarless and Williams will be. Considering that Finley is in his 4th year and still running the wrong routes, my impression is that Quarless and Williams might be the harder workers and show it by living up to their potentials.
Where do you get this from?
Finley is in his 4th year and still running the wrong routes.
He had the one play where he thought run and blocked, but came off it and caught a TD, other than that I’ve never read anywhere that Finley is running the wrong routes. I read everything on JS, GBPG site and Packers.com and never heard a word saying he’s running the wrong routes! Quarless has shown nothing lining up outside, he’s got speed but it doesn’t show up downfield, so he doesn’t play fast. Nor does he seem to get out of breaks quickly, which is how you get open. He also doesn’t play the ball in the air nearly as well as Finley. Williams while a good reciever is probably going to have trouble getting open in the NFL. His size is a big limiting factor too.
Where do you come up w/ this stuff? Running the wrong routes and not working hard? Finley from all the coaches, works extremely hard to become great, and wants to be great! Don’t make shit up that isn’t true!!
You've been Stroh'd™!!!
Maybe we should do a poll
Does all of Stroh’s BS equal making stuff up?
I’d say so!
Or maybe you shoud quite being petty
and making shit up!
You've been Stroh'd™!!!
by Strohman on Nov 1, 2011 10:32 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Finley IS far superior to the other TE's.
From JSO…
None of the four sits around and complains that they could be doing what Finley does because they know they can’t.
If they could do what Finley does, they would be getting more snaps. Right now, according to the article, Finley plays 80% of offensive downs and the rest get a total of 28% combined.
You've been Stroh'd™!!!
Double TE formations
I’d love to see us use double TE formations and throw out of these more. I agree with Brandon; we’ve got receiving talent behind Finley, and it is being underutilized. Of course, that hasn’t hurt us in anyway.
I wouldn’t be surprised to see MM do more of this later in the year, especially if teams figure out how to slow down the WRs a little.
I'd love to see triple TE formations more.....
In Every Climb and Place....
by PhoenicianPakFan on Oct 29, 2011 2:24 AM CDT up reply actions
Those would be fine too ...
but pass out of them.
And then they all crash the middle of the field on their routes...
taking out the LBs while the line pushes straight forward and Rodgers rushes.
In Every Climb and Place....
by PhoenicianPakFan on Oct 29, 2011 10:55 PM CDT up reply actions
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