Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Pro Quality. Fan Perspective.
Login-facebook
Around SBN: Trent Richardson Interviews Fellow Brown Brandon Weeden

The NFL Lockout Explained With Stick Figures

Yesterday I had a quote from NFL Negotiator Jeff Pash in which he said that, in the end, all the players wanted to talk about was money. He also said that the final offer wasn't "put out there as take it or leave it." That's pretty much the story told by Green Bay Packers president Mark Murphy, who said it only "was the basis for further discussions."

That's not what former union boss DeMaurice Smith heard. From SB Nation's exclusive interview

"Jeff [Pash] only has a casual relationship with the truth. Jeff knows that the NFL's deal was an all-or-nothing deal."

In the meantime, Vikings P Chris Kluwe has it all explained in convenient cartoon form:

Kluwe2_medium_medium

Larger version available here.

Comment 20 comments  |  0 recs  | 

Do you like this story?

More from Acme Packing Company

Insert Upbeat Title Here

Oct 2009 by Mitchell Maurer - 206 comments

Packers Sign Another Punter

Dec 2008 by Brandon - 1 comment

Comments

Display:

The players work for the owners.

They have no right to ask for private financial information. They can strike. They can negotiate. But they have no right to see any financial information the owners don’t want to show them.

It’s weird. I’ve got nothing against labor usually. But the more I hear about this mis-characterization ploy by the union, the more annoyed with them I get. It’s just a constant refrain of “Show us your financials!!!” If I were the owners, I’d be like “Why? Show me YOUR financials.”

by Curly Lambeau on Mar 18, 2011 6:11 PM CDT reply actions   1 recs

Now that would be interesting

financial records of the union as well as all of the players

TBD

by pumpkinking on Mar 18, 2011 8:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

Why?

because they are claiming they need more money to make a profit.

13.

by Wiedmann on Mar 18, 2011 8:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

The True Story

 There is a general misunderstand about that this Lockout is all about. We are dealing with two different levels of employee relationships on the part of the players. One was the group relationship represented by the Union in the past and now represented by the Players Association, which is different from the union in that it can not speak in any binding way for the players. The second level is the players as independent contractors. The Union’s role in the past was to set up the basic floor level that affected all of the players, from the rookie fourth string lineman to the star like Revis, or Brady, this is the CBA. This floor governs the pay of 90% of the players.

The other employee relationship was that of the independent contractor which is completely separate from the Union, but is build on CBA foundational floor. The CBA can be considered as a common clauses in all contracts. In theory the independent contractor status exists for all players, but in reality it does not, the rookie fourth string lineman is too easy to replace. Their relationship to the employer is solely governed by the CBA. They are not able to get for themselves benefits above and beyond those found in the CBA.

When you join a union, you certify that it can act on your behalf in certain things, but only in certain things. It can act on your behalf to set up a minimum salary for all its members. It can act on behalf of all its members to set up a minimum pool of money for the members of each team or even a maximum pool (the cap) for all the players as a group. But no player gives the Union the right to set up an maximum for any individual player. Each player reserves that right as an individual, and to give up that right is in fact a restraint of trade and is illegal under the law.

The owners want to shrink, in effect, that common money pool available to all the players in the future. But a player like Revis or Brady will always have the right to hold out – refuse to play – for any team. This lockout is not about Billionaires vs Millionaires, but rather Billionaires vs the great mass of players who make the minimums under the CBA. Some players will always be millionaires, and will not be effected no matter what the new CBA is. But the fourth string lineman will be.

by viguy007 on Mar 18, 2011 8:55 PM CDT up reply actions   2 recs

I think you're confusing "right to ask" with "ability to compel".

Of course the players have the right to ask for private financial information, just like the owners have the right to refuse to reveal it.

The real question is: is it a reasonable request? Evidently, you think not. Having spent my career watching corporate finance guys spin facts into stories, I tend to be suspicious of purely “bottom-line” assertions, so I think it is a reasonable request. If one party to a negotiation tells the other party that concessions are mandatory, lest the first party go out of business, it is pretty reasonable for the second party to say “convince me”.

by bob47 on Mar 18, 2011 11:39 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Do you have the right to ask your boss for financial records?

No, so what gives the NFL players the right to ask their boss for financial records? It’s no different. The NFL is a business, we all know that. Is it fair? Maybe not. But it is what it is.

Superbowl Champs Baby!!!!!

13 World Championships, soon to be 14 after next season...GUARANTEED!!!!!

Nuff said....

by Jabooty on Mar 18, 2011 11:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

DeMaurice

Clearly DeMaurice hasn’t heard that you look better when you don’t call people liars and other non-sensical names! He would have alot more credibility if he would take the high road or talk in general terms w/o calling the opposition liars! I have a hard time believing anything that comes our if DeMaurices pie-hole anymore! Everything is liar this, liar that kinda crap!

Owners already offered up unprecidented financial info to show their case… Maybe if DeMaurice actually bothered to look at them, instead of dismissing them out of hand, a deal could get worked out!!

You've been Stroh'd™!!!

by Strohman on Mar 18, 2011 6:40 PM CDT reply actions  

Yeah, having auditors and bankers working for the union look at the numbers

to determine if they were useful is not dismissing them out of hand.

Greinke: "It’s not about the guacamole itself. I just don’t want to let them win."

by GoGregGo on Mar 21, 2011 11:23 AM CDT up reply actions  

The evidence is pretty clear here, then

Vikings players are too dumb to understand anything outside of cartoon format

by vitaminx on Mar 18, 2011 7:09 PM CDT reply actions  

Damn.... you took my insult. I need to stop working late hours.....

The sad thing is, his cartoon is pointless. It’s still too complicated for Viking’s fans to understand.

by PhoenicianPakFan on Mar 19, 2011 2:22 AM CDT up reply actions  

I have a hard time thinking the owners are losing money

And as a fan, I would rather see the players get a better deal so they can give back to the community. I just don’t see the owners in the same light, to me they are only out for the profit :/

SUPER BOWL CHAMPS

by Chief Oshkosh on Mar 18, 2011 8:45 PM CDT reply actions  

The Problem

Is that the Profits are shrinking extremely quickly! packers was over 20M just 2 years ago and is now at about 5M… The player salaries are rising faster than Revenues are… Keeping this model will result in the teams LOSING money! Thats why this agreement is not sustainable… The owners haven’t said they are losing money yet, but its right around the corner… Now they are making significantly less than when the CBA was renewed in 06…

Thats why they opted out of the CBA! To get a model in place that allows both owners and players to make money!!

You've been Stroh'd™!!!

by Strohman on Mar 18, 2011 10:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

The player salaries are rising faster than Revenues

Should probably read… Expenses are rising faster than revenues

You've been Stroh'd™!!!

by Strohman on Mar 18, 2011 10:45 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm not an expert on NFL finance, but until 2010 there was a "salary cap"

that was set based on revenue, yes? So how could player salaries increase faster than revenue (league-wide)? Certainly, that could be the case for some teams, but it would have to be the opposite for other teams. And, since the owners chose to drop the salary cap in 2010, it would be more meaningful to compare 2009 results with prior years.

BTW, I realize that you amended “player salaries” to “expenses”. If I were a player, I’d kinda like to know what this surge in non-salary expenses was.

by bob47 on Mar 18, 2011 11:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

'06 CBA

The ‘06 CBA drastically changed the way the cap was determined! Since then player salaries and stadium expenses have been growing yearly while revenue has not. It was a major shift and I don’t pretend to know exactly how it all changed but from what I understand it went from an adjusted revenue amount to a % of gross revenue! Thats what started the dramatic shift towards excalating player costs… Read a little about it on Packers.com in a article by Vic about the CBA. Its a 2 part series that touches on the changes that occured w/ the CBA in ’06.. The change in the way the cap was determined is what is the root cause of the current predicament!

You've been Stroh'd™!!!

by Strohman on Mar 19, 2011 12:57 AM CDT up reply actions  

I can think of one

Insurance costs have probably risen both in terms of health insurance and the insurance taken out on player contracts

Every man must believe in something, I believe I'll have another drink.

by pjpaulus on Mar 19, 2011 6:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well done again, Mr. Kluwe.

"Finished putting together an Excel spreadsheet at work? BELT. Finally managed to open that uncooperative jar of mayonnaise? BELT. We're all champions in our own ways, my friends." - Frank Madden, BrewHoop

by Mitchell Maurer on Mar 18, 2011 9:50 PM CDT reply actions  

The cowboy hat shows both

That Kluwe is targeting Jerry Jones and that he does realize that Jerry and Bum Phillips are two different people

"IF CARDS CAN SIGN SUPPAN THEY CAN GIVE ME A HOME"

by Buddhasillegitimatechild38 on Mar 19, 2011 12:19 PM CDT via mobile reply actions  

Doesn't*

Typo fail

"IF CARDS CAN SIGN SUPPAN THEY CAN GIVE ME A HOME"

by Buddhasillegitimatechild38 on Mar 19, 2011 12:19 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

Comments For This Post Are Closed



Manager

Img00243_small Kevin McCauley

Editors

Texbucky_small texwestern

Author

Rubberducky_small Mitchell Maurer

Ayrton_senna_1988_canada_small Vermont Cubs Fan

Fallout-3-1010_small PackApologist

Gassertaylor_small OBrienSchofieldismyHero

Linkedin_picture_small Zack Ward

Carson-palmer-hot-dog_small MatthewJStein