Should The Packers Draft Charles Woodson's Replacement?
by Brandon on Feb 13, 2012 10:01 AM CST
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Mel Kiper Jr.: Replacing aging stars - NFC North Blog - ESPN. Over the weekend, Mel Kiper Jr. looked at a few NFC North veterans. He concluded that the current teams for these veterans should select their eventual replacements in this April's draft. For the Green Bay Packers, he discussed CB Charles Woodson.
Woodson is really old for a cornerback, he'll turn 36 during the 2012 season, so this is somewhat of an obvious choice. Even if he did look good enough in 2011 that he should have at least a couple more seasons left in him.
GM Ted Thompson hasn't used a lot of picks on cornerbacks, but he might have drafted CB Davon House last April as a future replacement. Based on playing time, it wasn't clear whether someone on the current roster could really step into Woodson's shoes in the future. When he didn't play last season, CB Jarrett Bush often filled in for him, but he can hardly be considered a long-term replacement himself.
Thompson doesn't seem to have a big school or small school preference for his defensive backs. While Morgan Burnett and Pat Lee came from big schools and conferences, he's also drafted House and selected Nick Collins from Bethune-Cookman.
While cornerback shouldn't be their top priority, maybe the Packers would be interested in someone like Chase Minnifield in the second round. He had a good eye for the ball in college (13 interceptions), and tackling is considered "one of his better traits." They might prefer a player who already has good fundamentals.
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Given Ted’s love of tall corners, I imagine some other names to track include Trumaine Johnson, Josh Norman, Donnie Fletcher, and Robert Blanton. FWIW, I think the upper round picks are likely to be used elsewhere, but anywhere from 3rd round on down is pretty fair game for a cornerback.
We already have Woodson's replacement on the roster
Tramon Williams. The question is who would be a good enough #2 to put on the other side in Tramon’s former role. Maybe Sam Shields will step up?
It would be difficult to truly replace Woodson who’s just a couple years removed from DPOTY but as for his role as being the #1 cover corner, Williams has shown in the past (and I believe he will again in the future) that he can step up into that. Having more depth at corner is obviously not a bad thing though, especially given our secondary’s historically bad record last year.
Tramon took over the #1 cover duties for the most part, hasn't he?
Wood is used as a rover, sometimes playing coverage, sometimes playing in the box, sometimes on the blitz.
Go Suns, Packers, Jays, and Huskers!
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I don't think the Packer can replace the things Wood does.
If they just want another CB, they got House last year who was rated about the same as Minnifield is and we got him in the 4th. If House had played at a bigger school and didn’t play w/ an ankle injury his Sr year, he might have been drafted much higher. New Mexico St is pretty small school in football terms. I Like House alot, but if Minnifield is there in the late 2nd and there aren’t better DL or OLB prospects, I wouldn’t have a problem w/ getting Minnififield. I like Norman in the 3rd too. Heard he played as well as any CB at the Sr bowl. Like most I would rather go OLB and DL in the top 2 rounds. At least Minnifield has the press coverage experience, similar to House last year and is a willing tackler. He would be a good addition to the secondary.
Our Biggest Challenge is how we deal w/ Success!
by Strohman on Feb 13, 2012 11:04 AM CST reply actions 3 recs
Exactly.
I don’t think the Packer can replace the things Wood does.
When Woodson is gone, we will probably have to alter our defensive scheme to adapt to the new player. Vitamin called Woodson a cover corner, but that isn’t exactly what he is for our defense. He’s more of a roaming body, a SS/CB/LB hybrid that covers a lot of underneath routes/supports the run D/blitzes often. While I believe that Tramon has surpassed Chuck in terms of a pure cover corner, he’s not a replacement. I’ll chalk up Tramon’s “down” year to his shoulder injury, having to play far off the line much more often than the Super Bowl year (perhaps to account for Collins being out), and the nonexistent pass rush. While Tramon didn’t meet the standards he set for himself a year before, he wasn’t as bad as he looked at points.
I already told you! I deal with the god damn receivers so the linebackers don’t have to! I have coverage skills; I’m good at covering people! Can’t you understand that? What the hell is wrong with you people?!
How do you replace a HoFer
If we were able to replace two in the same decade I don’t even know if that is possible. I really hope we pick up OLB/DE the first 2 rounds with all the talent that is there for those positions, but if TT feels like Woods replacement is there go for it. We have good cover DBs, but not a C-Wood. He is a special kind of talent that comes around once a decade or so. Besides Woodson moves to safety hybrid for the next 10 years.
Attitude is more important than the past, than education, than money, than circumstances, than what people do or say. It is more important than appearance, giftedness, or skill -Charles R. Swindoll
How do you replace a HoFer?
"Perfection is not attainable,
but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence!"
After further review,
The Munsters of the Midway still suck,
Skol is a four-letter word,
abd those upstarts in Detroit couldn't beat the Little Sisters of the Poor.
by NorthStarr on Feb 13, 2012 11:37 PM CST up reply actions 6 recs
RotY
Reply of the Year!
"I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous."
— Hunter S. Thompson
by I voted for Kodos on Feb 15, 2012 11:16 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
That’s why
I said 2 ;)
Attitude is more important than the past, than education, than money, than circumstances, than what people do or say. It is more important than appearance, giftedness, or skill -Charles R. Swindoll
I still couldn't resist. :)
"Perfection is not attainable,
but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence!"
After further review,
The Munsters of the Midway still suck,
Skol is a four-letter word,
abd those upstarts in Detroit couldn't beat the Little Sisters of the Poor.
On Minnifield
Good eye for the ball and strong tackling ability – to me that says safety and not corner.
"Who ever heard of the Cubs losing a game they had to have?" -Frank Chance
"If [Ruth] had [called his shot], I would have knocked him down with the next pitch." -Charlie Root
No Reason to Guess
The Packers draft strategy is always pretty simple. They just draft who they think is the best guy available. If there’s a good CB available, I’m sure TT will pull the trigger, but not at the expense of a better athlete at another position.
Exhibit A, Mr. Wilbur!
The Packers draft strategy is always pretty simple. They just draft who they think is the best guy available.
It ain’t that simple.
But, if enough people say it often enough, too many people start to believe it.
To paraphrase Mr. Churchill, misinformation gets half way around the workd before the truth can get its pants on.
BPA is only the foundation of his philosophy.
He also has plans for many contingencies, and thus, often deviates from “just drafting who they think is the best guy available.”
"Perfection is not attainable,
but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence!"
After further review,
The Munsters of the Midway still suck,
Skol is a four-letter word,
abd those upstarts in Detroit couldn't beat the Little Sisters of the Poor.
by NorthStarr on Feb 13, 2012 11:56 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
I saw that too Pat! Don't know how to put stuff in those pretty little boxes, or I would have! : )
Lol… I hope Konz is available at #28, along with a stud DE & OLB… Cuz I want to see which way TT will go… He can’t go wrong, but, I’m almost sure he will (Hell IDK! : ) probably go with a big guy… DL/OL… Can’t go wrong with big guys unless they are named Justin Harrell… lol
"SOUTHERN HILLS KENNEL" ~ We Breed The Best Bitches In TEXAS!!!
GO PACK GO!!!
Thank you
I acknowledge that there’s a BPA aspect but it’s not the only strategy TT employs. I think the BPA strategy also depends on what round we’re picking in, too.
"I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous."
— Hunter S. Thompson
by I voted for Kodos on Feb 15, 2012 11:24 PM CST up reply actions
ftfy
The Packers Raiders draft strategy is always pretty simple. They just draft who they think is the best fastest guy available. hehe.
The Packers draft strategy is actually very complex, of course their primary philosophy can be called BPA, that doesn’t mean anything, best is subjective, it’s TT’s opinion of what “best” that scores points on draft day. TT is all about value and maximizing the worth of the entire draft imo, he is flexible and prepared to adapt his plan at any moment. The packers draft strategy is anything other than simple, it’s simple to say you always take the best player, it’s a lot harder to really recognize who is the best.
by Tracker J Dunn on Feb 14, 2012 3:23 AM CST up reply actions 2 recs
About the draft
I was reading an article on compensation picks for 2012 and it said GB will likely get two 4ths for Jenkins and Colledge, and two 7ths for Spitz n Jackson. If you combine that with the two 7ths we are supposed to get for the Quinn Johnson n Schlauderauff trades, that wouldean we have 13 draft picks this year. I kind of find that hard to believe but that would be awesome. What do you guys think?
by Katsuya89 on Feb 13, 2012 12:35 PM CST via Android app reply actions
No pick for Johnson
Wasn’t with the Titans long enough unfortunately. Good thing about lots of draft picks is that it lets us move up in some rounds. Like trading our 3rd and 4th for a higher 3rd if someone is falling.
Expect some trades.
The Packers don’t have a lot of holes on their roster, certainly not 13 of them, so I expect picks are going to get packaged up to help them move around in the middle rounds.
Agree
No way we need 13 picks at this point. I can see maybe 9 or 10 picks tops. You’re wasting alot of picks if you have 13, given the talented roster we have already. It’s hard to keep more than 7or 8 new players on your roster after training camp and you will probably throw a couple at the practice squad. Plus you have UDFAs competing as well, and we always seem to have a few that stick. Time to do some major packaging of picks, and move up significantly in a few rounds of the draft. At this point I prefer quality over quantity even though it seems like you can never have enough DL or OL depth these days.
Yeah i was thinking the same thing. If they were to trade up in multiple rounds, they could turn those 12 or 13 picks into 6-8 quality picks.
by Katsuya89 on Feb 13, 2012 4:18 PM CST via Android app up reply actions
I hope so
I think this is a pretty deep draft, especially for our positions of need. Wouldn’t mind bundling and dealing later picks to move up if TT sees a steal in the third or fourth round.
Besides, with our success in developing undrafted free agents, doesn’t that mitigate our 6 and 7 round picks some as well?
Shit happens when you win championships
by Andrew Clark on Feb 14, 2012 2:50 PM CST up reply actions
Well, it's not a deep draft in terms of pass-rushers unfortunately.
Go Suns, Packers, Jays, and Huskers!
Read my thoughts on Creighton University athletics at Creightonian.com
I also edit things at Ridiculous Upside. Check it out.
Compensatory picks can't be traded
Of course we could still trade our regular picks, but I’m pretty sure you can’t trade compensatory picks.
"I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous."
— Hunter S. Thompson
by I voted for Kodos on Feb 13, 2012 9:38 PM CST up reply actions
Yes, you can't trade comp picks
What happens is you trade the pick from the round you have the comp pick in.
13.
"Skip, once again, stop it; Be an analyst; don't be a douchebag."
I'm not saying they're going to trade EVERY pick...
but having those comps certainly gives them more flexibility to trade their regular picks without completely trading out of a round.
The difference
Between last year and this year was the pass rush. TT will fill in DL and OL as much as possible in order to better protect his Franchise, and to allow the secondary to shine. If we had 13 picks I’d assume 7 to be used on DL and OL. Everything else is gravy.
Screw that.
Let’s draft QB’s with all our picks. Who knows, we may get another Matt Flynn!
I already told you! I deal with the god damn receivers so the linebackers don’t have to! I have coverage skills; I’m good at covering people! Can’t you understand that? What the hell is wrong with you people?!
Then we can Tag & Trade them!!! : ) lol
"SOUTHERN HILLS KENNEL" ~ We Breed The Best Bitches In TEXAS!!!
GO PACK GO!!!
I prefer we get a K and/or P early
competition in training camp!!!!!!!!!!
Shit happens when you win championships
by Andrew Clark on Feb 14, 2012 2:51 PM CST up reply actions
No, TT should swallow some pride and sign Courtland Finnegan as a FA.
by King Kelley on Feb 13, 2012 4:04 PM CST reply actions 3 recs
wouldn't mind this
football does not build character, it reveals character.
They have been trying to draft decent CBs for years
all failures so far. I’m not holding my breath they find a decent one this year, but always hope!
Sam Shields is a failure already?
Man, harsh standards. Tramon wasn’t exactly a touted prospect, all he needed was development time. Davon House was a rookie. How is he a failure already?
not drafted
Shields was a FA. Tramon was a FA pickup after failing to catch on with houston, who also got him as a FA I think. Lee, Bush, Underwood were all picks (i think) and haven’t panned out playing CB. House did nothing last year, hopefully he can at least play dime this year.
Well yeah, it sorta does. He said all Thompson drafted CB’s have failed — and they have! I’m sure he wasn’t including Shields because he wasn’t drafted.
by packallday555 on Feb 14, 2012 3:51 PM CST up reply actions
Semantics.
Developing a UDFA is no different than developing a draft pick. If they make the roster, what does it matter if they were drafted or not, from a developmental standpoint?
Obviously since Shields wasn't drafted
it means he wasn’t drafted. Hence the fact that Lee, Bush, Underwood, etc were early draft picks and have not lived up to expectations. Shields and Williams being undrafted sort of reinforces the notion that they have failed drafting CBs and have been forced to rely (and thankfully not been burned by) , on bargain deals. So it is more than just semantics.
by Glenn'sYank13 on Feb 14, 2012 4:46 PM CST up reply actions
if not for Shields and Williams,
the point is that poor drafting of CBs would have been devastating to the team. The poor draft choices would have been starters if not for the free agent finds. Not only that, every wasted CB of a draft pick cost the team a valuable pick which could have helped elsewhere
by Glenn'sYank13 on Feb 14, 2012 4:51 PM CST up reply actions
Bush was not a draft pick, either
and Underwood was a safety, not a CB.
13.
"Skip, once again, stop it; Be an analyst; don't be a douchebag."
Blackmon, not Bush, sorry
but I thought Underwood was a CB and they tried moving him to S
by Glenn'sYank13 on Feb 15, 2012 2:15 PM CST up reply actions
Underwood
Was a safety his Sr season in college, but the Packers drafted him as a CB. Then ended up moving him back to safety when that didn’t work out. Then moved on from him when his play didn’t improve and his off-field issues arose.
Our Biggest Challenge is how we deal w/ Success!
And if Bush was the 4th CB last year
that means the top 4 were all free agent pickups. Again, the drafting of CBs has been awful for a long long time. The ghost of Ahmad Carrol
by Glenn'sYank13 on Feb 15, 2012 2:17 PM CST up reply actions
Maybe the fact that we were able to turn UDFAs into starters meant we don't draft CBs at the top
You’re acting like we drafted a ton of CBs at the top of the draft.
Bush, Underwood, etc were early draft picks
Even if you did mean Blackmon, they both were 6th rounders, which are not “early draft picks”.
13.
"Skip, once again, stop it; Be an analyst; don't be a douchebag."
sorry, i guess
you can point to all the CB gems the Packers have discovered in the draft then. It’s not like the top 4 CBs were free agent acquisitions or anything
by Glenn'sYank13 on Feb 15, 2012 6:07 PM CST up reply actions
Jarrett Bush was not a free agent acquisition.
13.
"Skip, once again, stop it; Be an analyst; don't be a douchebag."
He was an UDFA
that I think was released by another team. Just like Tramon, either that or we picked him up after the draft. I don’t think he was drafted by anyone else, and I know he wasn’t drafted by the Packers. So what was he then?
He was a FA when the Packers acquired him. Doesn’t that qualify as a FA acquisition?
Our Biggest Challenge is how we deal w/ Success!
LOUD NOISES!
Author at Acme Packing Company, a Green Bay Packers blog, and Editor at BT Powerhouse, a Big Ten Basketball blog
Yes, I am on twitter. If you have to ask, you're streets behind.
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Feb 16, 2012 12:44 PM CST up reply actions
If your differentiating
between a waiver claim and a FA your really splitting hairs. Basically the same…
Our Biggest Challenge is how we deal w/ Success!
A post sex-change man is basically the same as a person born as a woman
It’s a difference to me.
13.
"Skip, once again, stop it; Be an analyst; don't be a douchebag."
Not semantics. There’s a reason they’re called UDFA’s (undrafted free agents)!
by packallday555 on Feb 14, 2012 7:38 PM CST up reply actions
Let me elaborate...
I don’t care how Shields or Williams came to the Packers. Williams is proof that great players aren’t necessarily the blue-chip draft picks, and that some players just need the opportunity to blossom. Shields has a ton of talent, I don’t know how he’s already a bust. House was a rookie who can’t be summarily dismissed. Just because Williams blossomed late doesn’t mean these guys will be stars, but it does mean they need more time to grow.
Lee and Underwood had that chance and don’t belong on the roster next season, and Jarrett Bush should be a full-time special teamer, but that doesn’t have anything to do with the development of Shields or House, or predict that they’ll be failures any more than Williams predicts they’ll be stars.
Shields just had a terrible sophomore slump.
Hopefully he pulls out of it with alacrity this year.
Author at Acme Packing Company, a Green Bay Packers blog, and Editor at BT Powerhouse, a Big Ten Basketball blog
Yes, I am on twitter. If you have to ask, you're streets behind.
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Feb 14, 2012 3:50 PM CST up reply actions
I'm cautiously optomistic he will
when we return to press coverage.
Lee has been a huge bust for a second round pick
Bush, well… I dunno. Some value in a special teams ace and he has gotten better in coverage…slowly. Underwood…sigh.
I’m still very optimistic about House (if he can stay healthy, seems to be a bit injury prone factoring in last year and college) and hopefully Sheilds improves.
Hard to judge the secondary when many were nicked up (Williams), we lost one of the best safeties in the league and opposing quarterbacks had all day to throw. I think the talent is their in the secondary and would prefer us to focus on the front 7 in the draft.
If there is another House type “steal” in the fourht or later I think TT will nab him. Otherwise, I can’t imagine us not selecting a DL, OLB or OL early on/
Shit happens when you win championships
by Andrew Clark on Feb 14, 2012 2:57 PM CST up reply actions
I really liked the House pick
But I don’t think we can call him a steal at this point. Last April we could call him a steal. In a few years we’ll hopefullly call him a steal. But after one year without significant playing time I think it’s hard to call him a steal.
PS I know I’m nit-picking here and I apologize for that (but not such a deep apology that I won’t post this).
"I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous."
— Hunter S. Thompson
by I voted for Kodos on Feb 15, 2012 11:46 PM CST up reply actions
Let's get Real
How about getting some DL that actually rush the passer and a speedy LB capable of blitzing, opposite of Mathews. The DB’s are fine, they can’t cover for 15 seconds with no pass rush! The only guy i would consider taking with pick #28 is Barron from Alabama and I fully anticipate he will be gone before pick 28. Trumaine Johnson would be a fine pick in Rd 3.
all defense draft
Here is what our draft strategy should be: take the best DE/OLB/CB available for EVERY PICK. Trade up if you can.
Here is what we’ll do: take the BPA regardless of position.
I understand...
But w/ the offense heavy draft last year and the problems on the DL and OLB those 2 positions gotta be a priority this draft. And you can never have enough CB… So I definitely think the Packers go Defense heavy at the top of this draft. Need an impact DE and OLB in the 2 of the top 3 rounds! Thats almost a must…
Our Biggest Challenge is how we deal w/ Success!
Absolutely
Need an impact DE and OLB in the 2 of the top 3 rounds!
Make the other pick a DB or G/C & we’re talking about a pretty nice haul from the top of our draft.
13.
"Skip, once again, stop it; Be an analyst; don't be a douchebag."
Yeah, with the great offense, heavy offensive draft last year and defensive problems- the only way I see GB picking offense in the first 2 rounds is if Andrew Luck or RG III is there. They of course use BPA, but they also use critical thinking and I’m sure they figured out that the defense needs some serious help.
maybe not though, I was hoping for more defensive picks last year, but we went mostly offensive and just brought in UDFAs.
by Tracker J Dunn on Feb 14, 2012 3:31 AM CST up reply actions
Should we draft Woodson's replacement?
Does a fish have a water-tight a$$?
I was at the philly game (4th and 26) and I was at the 08 NFC championship...history seems to repeat itself.
by 3rdigraphix on Feb 13, 2012 8:02 PM CST via mobile reply actions
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