Acme Packing Company: FanPosts

Just had to share

2009-11-07T02:12:37Z

I'm not too sure how many people here read Bill Simmons' column on ESPN, but I do. He's funny, and he normally seems like he has his head on straight. He's a much bigger Basketball guy than a Football guy, but he still cranks out columns giving the gambling lines on teams during the football season. For those of you who don't read him, here's what he had to say about the Pack vs Bucs game.

Packers (-9.5) over BUCS
Mayday! Mayday! The Josh Freeman 2009 White Flag has been thrown. By the way, Aaron Rodgers is this year's Great Game Against A Bad Team MVP. His stats have no correlation with his actual effectiveness. Even Al Bundy didn't hold his balls this long.

That last line killed me. If you're interested in more of his columns, I recommend looking up the Vengeance Scale. It should be required reading for just about everyone.

Finally, Go! Pack! Go!

...

What? I picked them in my survivor pool this week. Don't look at me like that.

Tex's Friday Preview - Tampa

2009-11-06T16:16:33Z

So...I kind of dropped the ball last week. Midterms caught up with me, and a big Halloween weekend in Madison (including two great Badger Hockey games and that 37-0 shellacking of Purdue) left me with no time on Friday to write a preview for that depressing game last week. But maybe it was for the best. That game was analyzed to death beforehand, and I don't know that I would have come up with anything new that would have been insightful or interesting anyway. In any case, I just wrapped up my one midterm for this week, and since there's none of the holiday craziness in the People's Republic of Madison this weekend, I can actually take a little time off to write up a preview.

The Packers have been fairly predictable this year. They beat the bad teams soundly (STL, DET, CLE) and lose to the very good teams (CIN, MIN). If that trend holds up, the Pack should beat Tampa by double digits this weekend. That said, here are a few things to watch.

1. The Offensive Line (big shocker here)

This is a perfect opportunity to rebound after the line was beaten like a drum by Jared Allen et al. A struggling Buccaneers defense without Monte Kiffin is exactly what the Packers' big uglies want to see to get some confidence back. When I look at your roster and the most recognizable names on the defensive line are Chris Hovan and Michael Bennett, I feel pretty good about going up against your defense. (And I only recognize the name Michael Bennett because he shares a name with a former badger running back).

2. Spencer Havner

This guy is quickly becoming one of my favorite players to watch, mainly because he is EVERYWHERE. I must digress here. In my fantasy league with Mitchell, one of our best friends from high school decided on Tuesday after the Browns game that he wanted to pick up Havner because his top TE was on a bye and his 2nd option, Jermichael Finley, just suffered his injury. The problem was, he wasn't even eligible as a TE yet on ESPN's fantasy service. We all laughed him off, and let him play a man down with an empty TE spot and I, as the commish, promised to add him if/when ESPN updated their rosters or give him credit for whatever points he did accrue. Little did we know that Havner would catch those two TDs against the Vikes and make our friend look like a freakin' genius. Anyway, back to my point. I'll be curious to see if Havner is still as involved in the offense as he's been the last two weeks. Plus, I love watching him cover kicks.

3. Linebacker issues

With the loss of Brandon Chillar, someone (I'm looking at you, A.J. Hawk) will need to step up and play well against the run this Sunday. Hawk showed flashes of his potential against a lesser team in Cleveland. Can he do it again in Tampa? I hope so. Then again, he vanished against Minnesota, proving that the Browns can literally make anyone look good on the right day. Hopefully Hawk will earn some extra confidence this week in the same way the O-line does.

Now I'm off to my last class of the day before Badger women's and men's hockey games at 2 and 7 respectively. As always, GO PACK GO!

Packer fans..check out a Video History of your team VS Bucs in Orange

2009-11-06T12:40:48Z

First of all I want to compliment you guys on a nice site! I will be on the field for pregame in this game and am very excited just to see the Green and Orange again!

For those of you Packer fans that remember the old days, I have done a video with highlights of a game from every year of the Bucs in Orange playing the Packers. The memories are plentiful..

(http://www.bucem.com/2009/11/6/1118516/throwback-memories-a-video-history)

Howard Cosells last game ever was Green Bay at Tampa Bay

Brett Favre's first completion was in Tampa vs Bucs

Packers clinch 96 playoffs in Tampa

and there are many more including Jacke's amazing last second FG in 89, Iguebuike and Husted's last second FG to beat you guys in 88 and 95 respectively, and the famous Snow Bowl where you could hardly see the Bucs in a field of Snow!

You can see all these clips and more in my movie, you are welcome to come over to Buc'em and check it out! I'll let the guys know your coming over!! Feel free to leave your comments too!!

Enjoy the Movie, and the game!

LINK TO VIDEO POST:

http://www.bucem.com/2009/11/6/1118516/throwback-memories-a-video-history

Please protect Aaron Rodgers.

2009-11-05T15:19:04Z

Is Aaron Rodgers the right man for the pack? I say hell yes. Funny that it took a Vikings reporter to lay it out so well.

Article here

It is easy to forget although he has been around several years, he is only 1/2 way through his second season as a starter. He is leading the league in sacks taken, and also in passer rating. He is amongst the leaders in most passing stats and has kept turnovers to a minimum. Yes, some of the sacks are on him to avoid, but that sort of production deserves some big kudos. I'm willing to cut him a break with all the production he has put up.

I am very concerned with the beating Rodgers is taking. He has injuries on both feet now? If this sack rate continues, odds are he doesn't make 16 starts this season. The single most frustrating thing for me this season has been the lack of progress in QB protection.

The O-line is in flux with injuries and that is a big part of the problem. Lack of depth, experience, and talent are combining to make this a tough egg to crack. On this site, I see posts every week calling for more slants, draws, screens, bootlegs, etc. Basically, all the classic tools used to slow down the pass rush. If memory serves, Green's reception last week was a screen. Beyond that, I have seen very little adjustment made in the scheme to address the problem. I have heard discussed TT does not like screens, but can't more be done?

I would like to see Rodgers pull the ball down and run a little more often. He has good wheels and can get yards in chunks. If he shows a willingness to do this more frequently, it will give opposing D's something else to prepare for, help him avoid sacks by getting out of the pocket before it collapses, and provide another way to gain some 1st downs.

It is funny that the sports coverage in Chicago is bemoaning the fact there wunderkind QB is getting hit too much and jeopardizing his future. He has taken 16 sacks. Protecting our QB must be the #1 priority. Is the GB press hitting this topic hard?

Many of these ideas have been previously brought up, but wanted to put them in one spot for discussion. I feel the health of our QB is far and away the main concern for the rest of the season and am frustrated by what I perceive to be a lack of progress.

Status of The Packers Post Week 8

2009-11-04T19:50:26Z

Week 8's loss to the Vikings has left many of us Packers fans in shambles but the outlook for the rest of the season is not so bleak. As it stands right now, if the playoffs were to start today, the Packers would be on the outside looking in but that does not mean that we don't control our own destiny due to our second half schedule. By dissecting the first 8 weeks of the season and breaking down the team by positions hopefully we can clearly the muddy waters that has been the Packers season thus far.

Offense

Quarterback

We all understand that Aaron Rodgers is an upper echelon quarterback but the way he has been playing is not only dictated by the position he is in. It doesn't matter if you put Rodgers behind the NFC's Pro Bowl offensive line, he just isn't giving himself a chance to be successful. His stats show that he is clearly having a great season but numbers only go so far without game film. Aaron is holding onto the ball for too long, this could mean one of two things, either Mike McCarthy is calling a bad game because his routes are taking too much time to develop against talented pass rushers like Jared Allen, or Aaron Rodgers is not going through his progressions properly. Against a team like the Vikings, who in my opinion have the best defensive line in football, he has to understand that his progressions have to be quicker and he has to be able to check down or throw away the ball before being hit. On the lighter side of this, Rodgers has displayed his athletic side as he stands second in rushing on the Packers. Obviously the sacks are not all his fault, (the offensive line will be addressed later) but to take that next step in his progression towards becoming an elite quarterback, he has to start to understand the game on a level that only elite quarterbacks can.

Wide Receiver

As usual, WR is a strong point of the Packers but the production is coming from different sources then the past few years. Most experts predicted that Greg Jennings would be the focus of the offence, thus moving him into the realm of top receivers in the NFL, surprising to most, Jennings is off to a slow start. The bulk of the receiving load has been carried by steady veteran Donald Driver, who leads the Packers in almost all receiving categories. The signs coming from Driver are very positive as some experts predicted his eventual demise due to age. The third and fourth receiver spots are nearly interchangeable with James Jones and Jordy Nelson playing key parts in 3 and 4 receiver sets. Unfortunately for Nelson, he has been sidelined for a significant portion of time and was unable to contribute, leaving the door open for James Jones who has been alright but nothing spectacular. The 5th receiver spot has been left vacant after the season ending injury to Brett Swain. The receivers should continue to be solid throughout the year but for the Packers to dominate like they did in the preseason, they are going to need Greg Jennings to return to his deep threat form.

Running Backs

The primary runner for the Packers over the past three seasons has been Ryan Grant and it has become painfully obvious that he probably will not return back to 2007 breakout form. To the dismay of many, the Packers seem to be one of the only teams in the NFL to not deploy a running back by comity system, essentially because Ryan Grant is the only NFL starting caliber running back on the Packers roster. The addition of Ahman Green and the success of Brandon Jackson on third down is nice but the Packers need a second option to run the ball with consistency. Obviously this saviour back is not going to come out of nowhere midseason (Samkon Gado and 2007 Ryan Grant happen to disagree) but for the Packers to have success in the future, they must improve at this position. As for the rest of the season, lets keep our collective fingers crossed that Ryan Grant stays healthy and keeps up his average performances.

Offensive Line

The Packers offensive line has been exactly that, downright offensive. With different combinations seemingly each week, fans are subject to the horror of watching the oppositions best pass rusher, (Jared Allen, Antwan Odom, Adewale Ogunleye) bear down on the future of the Packers franchise. This constant barrage of sacks seems to be getting to Aaron Rodgers and beyond staying healthy, he has to stay confident for us to win. Its not to say that Mike McCarthy hasn't been trying though, LT Chad Clifton and C Jason Spitz have been injured for multiple games thus throwing rookie T.J Lang and former starter Scott Wells into the fire, or forcing McCarthy to move LG Daryn Colledge to LT thus moving Spitz to LG. Despite the attempted quick fixes, the Packer had nearly zero success in the trenches thus far. On that note, a life raft is heading our way with the return of Chad Clifton and the eventual return of Mark Tauscher, recently resigned off the free agent wire. Putting T.J Lang and Allen Babre back on the bench can hopefully help stop the bleeding because if these problems aren't fixed, the Packers will sink faster then the titanic.

Tight Ends

Jermichael Finley has finally started to produce with some consistency, unfortunately he is sidelined with an injury, allowing Donald Lee to step back into the role as the primary receiving threat from the tight end position. The surprise of the season has been the recent effectiveness of Special Team/Linebacker/Tight End Spencer Havner in the red zone. Havner has three touchdowns in two games and him and Rodgers seem to be on the same page. With the eventual return of Finley and the emergence of Havner, the Packers look fine at the tight end position.

Full Back

The Packers enjoy running out of the full house back field allowing them to use two full backs, Korey Hall and John Kuhn, but that has not been the case this season. With Korey Hall down with an injury, the Packers have changed there approach allowing John Kuhn to be the goal line back and letting rookie Quinn Johnson take over the majority of blocking duties. To an extent this has been successful and it seems the Packers will deploy these looks for the remainder of the season.

Defense

Defensive Line

The success of the defensive line has, and will continue to be, a very big factor in the success of the team. The nose tackle position has been the most consistent position along the line due to Ryan Pickett's successful first half. As for the defensive ends, they have been nonexistent at times but when the rotation of B.J Raji, Cullen Jenkins and Johnny Jolly show up, they have been very solid.The Packers improved run defense is in large part due to the success of the line but in order for the Packers to make that jump they must get some sort of pass rush working in obvious passing situations.

Linebackers

The transition from a 4-3 to a 3-4 has not come easy for the Packers this year, especially for the linebackers. The first half was not up to expectations for this revamped, Dom Capers led defense and most of the blame is shifting towards the linebackers and the play calling. As expected, Aaron Kampman has been seemingly lost in pass coverage and has been less effective in rushing the passer without his hand in the ground, these factors alone made him a commodity prior to the trade deadline. The Houdini act that A.J Hawk is playing with Packers fans is really puzzling as he will have games where he has 9 tackles then a week later he will only play 9 snaps. The spotty play of A.J Hawk has opened the way for a nice rotation at the inside linebacker position involving Nick Barnett, Hawk, Brandon Chillar and occasionally Desmond Bishop. Once again the solid run defense is in large part to the sideline to sideline abilities these athletes have and this should continue throughout the season. The best player amongst the linebackers has been rookie OLB Clay Matthews who seems to get better every snap he takes. After taking over the starting position during the Packers visit to the Metro Dome, he has been imposing his will on opposing running backs and quarterbacks. The continued improvement of Matthews along with the use of Aaron Kampman in a three point stance on obvious passing downs will hopefully create more pressure leading to more success, failing these things the Packers should BLITZ every so often.

Cornerbacks

The duo of Al Harris and Charles Woodson haven't exactly been showing their age, but they haven't been locking down either. The Dom Camper's defensive scheme is not something Al Harris is used to because it does not call for him to be physical at the line thus devaluing his play slightly. Charles Woodson on the other hand is playing up to his ability at this point in his career, which is still a very high level. The one aspect which puzzles me a lot is that Charles Woodson has not been called up to blitz as often as he should. In the preseason the Packers used many exotic blitz packages including using Woodson in many of them and we all know the success of the Packers defense in the preseason. As for the nickel position, I have been very impressed with the play of Tramon Williams. Quietly, Tramon is in on many plays and he rarely gets beat. As long as the Packers can generate a decent pass rush their secondary should be more then adequate.

Safeties

When healthy, Atari Bigby and Nick Collins make up a more then formidable duo, but healthy is the key word in that statement. Atari missed significant time earlier in the season opening up space to put in the revolving doors of Aaron Rouse (on the NY Giants now) and Darrick Martin and needless to say they lacked the skill to be regular NFL players. Nick Collins could miss some time after sustaining an injury in the Vikings game and that could spell trouble for the Packers. The run support from Atari Bigby is a strength as usual and when both are playing, they have not been the source of the problems. Once again the problems stem from the lack of pressure, bringing Atari up to the line for a few blitzes would not be a bad idea because he has shown proficiency at this in the past.

Upcoming Schedule

Our next game which is @ Tampa Bay should look very much like the Cleveland and Detroit games so nothing should be taken from that game. Dallas and San Fran coming to Lambeau have wild card implications and even though it is still fairly early, every game is important from here on. After that the Packers to Detroit for the Thanksgiving game which should be another cupcake. The hardest part of our season is Baltimore, @ Chicago and @ Pittsburgh where it would be ideal if we came out with two wins, these games will see if the Packers are a Playoff team. Then we finish with Seattle and across the country @ Arizona. The last two game will probably be must wins and the Packers may be in luck depending on how well Arizona does in the second half, they could see alot of back ups in a must win scenario.

Predicted Final Record- 10-6

Whether 10-6 will get us a playoff spot is yet to be seen.

Your Proverbial Conspiracy Theory...

2009-11-04T05:51:20Z

First off, let me preface this post by saying that I live in Green Bay and I have the privilege to go to many game at Lambeau Field. I have seen Brett Favre do some magical things and some bone-headed things (see 07 NFC championship game). However, as I watch this season unfold with him in purple viking gear, there appears to be empirical evidence that Favre may have been more valuable on so many levels to our young packers team than we thought.

In retrospect, 2007 appeared to be a complete mirage on many levels--Ryan Grant was the darling running back picked up off the NY Giant's scrap heap, our team was winning every close game, Greg Jennings was quickly becoming a star and TT/MM looked like geniuses. How the mighty have fallen so quickly...BUT, as much as it pains me to admit this--the man that made things possible during that dream run in the fall of 2007 was none other than BF.

Brett Favre seemed to be the only true veteran that, in my opinion, might have guided and held our young team accountable during TT's tenure and through the magical 07 season--as much as we blast Favre for how he exited GB or how aloof in the locker room he was, the numbers don't lie--we have sucked since he left and he is the only player of substance that has left our team. (Cullen Jenkins was injured much of last year so he would be a close second, all things being equal). Favre makes players around him better--that's a fact...players want to do their best around him and for him--that's a fact. I think Favre asked for his release in the spring of 2008 more so because he wanted to be on a team with established, savvy veterans and key free agents--players like the ones that he was used to winning with like Reggie White, Sean Jones & Keith Jackson--the Vikings fit that mold to a "T" and happened to play in our division. If Favre had to waste a year in NY to get to Minnesota it was worth it to him--the bonus was being able to stick it to TT when he did get to the Vikings. Perhaps in the spring of 2008 Favre knew how poor the discipline, work ethic or accountability was on the youngest team in the league--he was too old to wait around to find out if he was right or wrong--he didn't want to take that chance with a bunch of young punks who didn't know or care to know who Kitrich Taylor was. Perhaps he saw MM as more of an enabler willing to put up with a young team's gaffs, penalties and lack of accountability.

With us losing TWICE this year in less than stellar fashion to the Vikings, the Packers Players and coaches as human beings have to be wondering how Favre ended up doing them in like he did. TT made the right move to jettison BF to the Jets because he CORRECTLY knew what he had in Aaron Rodgers and we needed to take control of the franchise back. The gross miscalculation that TT failed to account for was the bitterness, spite and competitiveness that a player like Favre can harbor, nurture and then materialize into the ass-kicking that he laid on our Packer team TWICE this year. TT's worst nightmare has become reality this year--he wasn't beaten by Adrian Peterson, who is the best offensive player in the league according to some, he was beaten by the same quarterback that killed our Cinderella Superbowl team of 2007 that wasn't meant to be.

I'm not saying that Brett Favre was like Reggie White in that if you got a bone-head penalty he would be in your grill, but since he left our team has horrid discipline during games and seems very lethargic and nonchalant during big games. Jonny Jolly's penalty was horrible on so many levels--his excuse for it after the game was actual more horrible than the penalty itself! I never recall any coach almost losing a locker room while Brett Favre was here--but in seven games this year Mike McCarthy appears to be one bad loss away from losing the locker room--and ultimately his job.

Aaron Rodgers will do great things in his career I believe, but we are the youngest team in the league for the 4th consecutive year...now more than ever we are acting like it. A little veteran leadership can go a long way.

What to make of this team

2009-11-04T03:48:36Z

I'm sure most of you have read what Cullen Jenkins had to say after Sunday's game in which the defense gave up four passing touchdowns to Brett Favre and the Vikings. And I'm sure some of you have also read what ESPN.com NFC North Blogger Kevin Seifert makes of the situation. This defense is in trouble, right? Just look at the three games played against legit NFL Offenses, doesn't look that much different than last year, does it? Maybe we're just kidding ourselves that this can be a playoff team, specifically one that can hold a good NFL offense in check. Maybe this defense just isn't going to get it done.

Geez, but then look at the rankings. Our defense is in the top ten in both scoring and total defense. And so what if we only shut out Detroit. I mean Pittsburgh gave up twenty points to Detroit.

But now of all times, is when we could actually stand to listen to some advice of two brothers from Minnesota of all places. For those of you who saw the Coen Brothers' newest movie 'A Serious Man', perhaps you remember this quote on the screen just as the film started.

"Receive with simplicity everything that happens to you."

-Rashi

The problem with the Packer's season so far, is that we haven't really faced much league average competition. Of course thats bound to happen when league average teams are at such a premium at the moment. In the three wins against the cellar dwellers, the defense performed at or above expectations. In the three losses against what looks to be very good teams, the defense performed at or below expectations. There's really been so little to go on to formulate expectations for the rest of the year, not only for the defense but for the entire team, and thats what has been most frustrating for me so far this season.

I mean, I have as good a grasp on this team as I did opening day, which in short means not much.

I think because of this, this season, more than any other I've followed, I've been particularly antsy between games and that really gets frustrating. I've tried to teach myself not to put too much stock into the previous week's game in assessing our chances for the rest of the season, but due to the bipolar competitive nature of our opponents this year, even thats become hard. I almost want the Packers and the defense to have a statement game one way or the other just so I can get a grasp.

We don't know, we just don't know how good this defense or team can be. Seeing as the Coen Brothers' 'A Serious Man' is a 1960's retelling of the story of Job, all of us Packer fans could sure exhibit some patience, including myself.

Interviews with Bart Starr, Jan Stenerud, and Paul Krause up now at DN

2009-11-04T03:26:51Z

Hi everyone at ACP! Eric here, a co-writer for the Daily Norseman. I usually only venture to these parts to troll (kidding!), but I figured that you guys might be interested in the articles I've posted at the DN over the past couple days.

Thanks to SB Nation being involved with the Van Heusen and JCPenney Hall of Fame promotion, I had the incredible opportunity to interview three NFL Hall of Famers before the game on Sunday. I'm guessing you may have heard of a couple of them. Below are links to my interviews with Bart Starr, Jan Stenerud, and Paul Krause:

Stenerud: http://www.dailynorseman.com/2009/11/3/1113668/van-heusen-hall-of-fame-interview

Krause: http://www.dailynorseman.com/2009/11/3/1113732/van-heusen-hall-of-fame-interview

Starr: http://www.dailynorseman.com/2009/11/3/1113815/van-heusen-hall-of-fame-interview

I also gave a quick review of my debut at Lambeau Field yesterday. I even put a slide show at the end chronicling my experience. Let me tell you, it was nothing short of amazing. I quickly realized that we're getting jobbed on the total NFL experience here in Minneapolis! I mention this in the article, but I was refreshingly surprised at nearly all of my interactions with Packer fans. I know both our fan bases have a few bad apples that can really give us a bad name, but it was great to see the majority of "real" Packer fans in person on Sunday. I can't wait to visit again!

Ted Thompson for president....

2009-11-03T02:56:54Z

Of antartica he needs to go I'm not faulting him for getting rid of favre he had to go. It's the O-line I think he should be sent out on a rail for completely destroying a proud offensive line. I sat and watched another trade deadline go bye anxiously awaiting a trade for somebody. My dad said don't worry they'll fix it by week 8 apparently not what the hell are we doing. this general manager is gonna sit on his ass and watch aaron turn into david carr thanks ted you douche

Thanks, Packer Fans!

2009-11-03T01:47:30Z

I just wanted to thank all you guys at the Acme Packing Company for allowing me and a couple other guys to come over here and discuss things about yesterdays game without running us out of town on a rail. I appreciate you guys as fans, and appreciate a very interesting game yesterday! FYI to anyone who was aware of "The Bet", i got my diet mountain dew today, but bought my old band teacher lunch to show there were no hard feelings!! thanks again, all!

What was this 3-4 supposed to buy us again?

2009-11-03T01:27:09Z

I have an idea. After being schooled by Favre for like 95 minutes this year, with about 10 minutes left in the 3rd quarter and 3rd and 17, let's rush 3, cause Favre has proven he can't figure it out when we do. Wasn't this defense supposed to be the unpredictable, pressuring type that quarterbacks can't coexist with? When he was finally humiliated enough to pressure Favre, the next series, a 3 and out, Favre released a couple of quackers that could have been easily intercepted. It is just hard to fathom a scenario that allows the Favre legend to grow anymore than a defensive coordinator who just lets it happen. Our defense had nothing for Favre until being totally humiliated, and that is the fault of Capers.- The aforementioned 3 man rush was embarrassing and the results were predictable, as I moaned before the completion, which was followed up by a 50 yard td strike. Thompson is just stubborn, the O line will fix itself, cause he won't do anything about it, but the man power is there on the D. The coaching is lacking. Good thing we play so many terrible teams this year. We may still make the playoffs. Where we will 3 man rush ourselves into oblivion.

The Great Favre Debate.

2009-11-02T23:13:04Z

First, I have to let you know that I am visiting this site from Silver and Black Pride. I got tired of writing about the crappy team I root for and wanted to write about something that is relevant. I envy your team, as it has something newsworthy that doesn't revolve around its head coach allegedly smacking bitches and hitting women.

“You just don’t turn your back on 16 years of greatness,” according to Vikings defensive end Jared Allen.

One thing I know after Sunday, November One is: Jared Allen is absolutely correct.

No one turns their back on 16 years of greatness—they use it to tear them apart; use it to fixate on the past while focusing the frustration of it’s passing into the form of one person.

It is romanticized. While lamenting the agony of it’s now intangible reality it can create a chasm or straddle the divide and holding a dual existence—occupying both the love and hate areas of the brain and heart.

In other words, we do not turn our back on prolonged periods of greatness, we just use it to severely fuck ourselves in the head. It is the kind of fodder that makes therapists rich. It originates from the source that fuels the middle age purchasing of sports cars and allows young girls to fulfill daddy fantasies.

Everyone has his or her own way to deal with the passing of something and this is only magnified whenever this process comes into existence in a less than ideal way.

To see the reality of this theory, one needs to look no further than the Packer faithful, which I am counting, roughly, as the entire state of Wisconsin.

The sight of their one true love donning and sharing the company with their most hated rival tore fans. It became apparent before the game started, however, which side of the spectrum the majority of the Cheeseheads landed on.

Favre ran onto a field, that according to one sign held by a fan is “the field that Favre built,” during pre-game introductions to a deafening chorus of boos.

The heights of ecstasy leave people vulnerable to the inevitable drop off. It can be hard to see a former love thriving and embracing the love of a bitter rival. Just ask Packer fans:

"He was," Packer fan Jo Sedar said, "one of us."

"It's like going into church on Sunday and the priest says, 'Everybody go home. Jesus has now sided with the devil,'" said Tom Fields.

On Sunday T-shirts at Lambeau carrying messages ranging from "Traitor" to "Judas" to "Drama Queen" to “We’ll never forget you BRENT,” were seen throughout the stadium.

While these feelings encapsulated the feelings of the majority in attendance, it certainly wasn’t the only way they felt. Packer fans were on both sides of the spectrum and everywhere in between.

"I'm having mixed emotions," said Robert Barranco, while dressed in a green Favre jersey.

His wife, Martha, was wearing the purple edition and was just as torn as Robert. "I'm a die-hard Packers fan, but I also want him to do well."

Also popular were half Minnesota-half Green Bay jerseys, while some fans wore Favre's Vikings jersey underneath Packers jackets.

Then there were the fans that were there to profess their love for Brett.

There were signs throughout the stadium ranging from, "Thanks 4 the Memories” to “Lambeau is Brett's Field."

It is obvious that whatever it is that some people have, which inspires people to say they have “it,” Favre has in spades. You are hard pressed to find a person who does not have an opinion on him one way or the other.

As Brett Favre has spent his offseasons plucking petals off flowers while saying, “retire me—retire me not” each petal plucked was reported ad nauseum. It got to the point that there were days in the sport’s world where the lead story was the fact that the Brett Favre story was getting too much coverage.

“Is Farve coming back, or isn’t he” would be the opening refrain of many stories and they would continue, “no one knows and it is this reporter’s opinion that the thoughts and time spent on a washed up QB waffling about his future are a waste of time. This is the story that won’t die. Stay tuned, as this is the first segment of a 908 installment piece on this worthless obsession with Brett Favre.”

This kind of thought process has followed Favre into the season as hours before the game there was a plane flying overhead pulling a sign that read “Retire 4 Good”. Maybe one reading “So I can stop caring” should have followed it.

Of course ultimately Packer fans should have followed that sign with one that read “Please,” because they seemed to wake the sleeping giant.

Favre got viewings and earfuls of all the varying feelings he inspired. "Cheers, a couple fingers. Some people, not exactly mooning ..." Favre said. "That part was a little weird."

Favre let his game show fans while they should never expose their ass to a legend.

After twisting Packers fans minds towards therapy with his retirement tangos, team hopping and rival embracing existence, Favre gave the entire state of Wisconsin the Kobe treatment, and by Kobe treatment I mean asshole tearing and by asshole tearing I mean what A-Rod does do Derek Jeter every night in his dreams and by that I mean look at this.

While the game went on it became apparent that Farve was out for blood. As any ultra-competitive person would, he used his scorn to help fuel his desire. Farve was hugging teammates and raising a finger (the index) after touchdowns.

There were plenty of touchdowns. Four of his 17 completions were for touchdowns and while the Packers mounted a late comeback to make things semi interesting, Favre made sure this game stayed on ice with a late fourth quarter touchdown pass.

Favre was having so much fun carving up the Packers defense I expected him to fake the victory kneel and bomb it to a wide open streaking Viking receiver for a fifth touchdown as time expired. Then run off the field with his middle fingers flying asking the boo birds and the Packer brass if they brought enough lube.

This did not happen; however, as Favre is a serial flip flopper. He cannot even decide if he wants to enhance Packer fans memories of him or distance himself from that legacy.

Ever the politician, Farve encrypted the real meaning in his post game comments in sports talk. Don’t worry I have brought the staff translator to decode the hidden messages.

"I had mixed emotions coming in, because I know how special these fans are," Favre said.

Translation: I love the fans, but I hate the fat, stupid decision makers that wouldn’t know greatness if it slapped them in the face.

"But I also know the Packer fans are what makes this organization so special, unique, and that will never change. How could you not miss that?"

Translation: The fat, stupid decision makers suck. People that love me are cool.

Asked if he was surprised at the reaction, Favre said, "Sure, I would have loved ..." and then paused. "It was about what I expected," he said.

Translation: They’ll forgive me because I made this team. I did more for this team than the fat, stupid decision makers.

"I want to lead this Vikings team to a Super Bowl, believe me, I do. And I will do everything in my power.”

Translation: I am on a quest to prove that I am “The One” and it was wrong for the fat, stupid decision makers in Green Bay to not give me whatever I wanted.

"Although I wasn't expecting a standing ovation, I know what I've done, what I stand for," Favre said. "What I've done here speaks for itself. What I was a part of was awesome. That will never change."

Translation: “I created something totally rad in Green Bay and while the whinny fans are a little bitter now they will remember whose right arm delivered them to the gates of Nirvana when it is all said and done.”

"I was part of some pretty good games here as a Packer. This is pretty high up on the list," Favre said of the win. "It was pretty awesome to be a part of."

Translation: Revenge is like cheese—it makes everything better. I just fed the Cheeseheads cheese. I am really great.

"It was loud, and that's what makes Green Bay such a special place," said Favre,

Translation: I just want to reiterate that in no way is it because of the fat decision makers that the Packers have achieved greatness.

"I've never been one to rub it in anyone's face," Favre said. "The guys I played with as a Packer, I've got a lot of respect for them. As I do for the organization and the fans."

Translation: I am rubbing your faces in it by saying I am not. I won, I won, I won! Sure I’ve got respect for the organization and the fans. They once put cheese on my table.

It became apparent that the results of the, to quote Paul McCartney, “the long and winding road,” of the Farve drama worked out best for the teams and the players involved. Rodgers is a fantastic quarterback and was ready to get his career as a starter underway. While Farve still has game left in his body—game that would not be as apparent behind the Packers struggling offensive line.

It also became apparent that the people who have benefited most by this course of events are the practicing therapists in the state of Wisconsin.

Poll

I feel

To Ted: Please trade for Steven Jackson

2009-11-02T19:31:30Z

I know what everyone is thinking, Ted Thompson would never make a trade or high draft picks for a player but come oooonnnnn! Jackson is a beast and Ryan Grant is not the answer. For once Ted, please do something about the running game. I watched Jackson yesterday tear up the running for 147 yds and a td, not even mentioning the receiving yards he had. He constantly took on tacklers and shook them off. Name the last time you saw that happen in a Packers uniform. He is an amazing player, playing with a mediocre to good O-line, on a terrible team. So what is you give up a few picks and some role players, he would improve the run game alone. Maybe I'm dreaming but how else will you immediately improve the run game than trading for an elite runner. Ryan Grant and Brandon Jackson are not the answer, and a high pick runner next year will never make an impact fast enough.

only if

2009-11-02T06:33:58Z

Ni Haw

today is the turning point of green cheese, we once had it clean and easy. But made a decision to throw out the good with bad. Now that someone scraped a little better than we thought possible. As true no minded thinkers we complain that we do not need the good cheese. Finding out later that it has been shipped out on a viking ship setting sail to the SUPER BOWL, without us in tow. The only reason we were ever in any game especially in 1996 is that we did have a special player in Brett Farve. Be thankful he is forty because until he really retires and in the HALL OF FAME will he be a green bay packer again. Remember your the team that says he cannot play anymore. Thanks for the best player we could have put in as quarterback

The Aftermath

2009-11-02T05:42:07Z

Somehow I always kind of figured it would wind up like this.

10 years ago to the day, Mike Holmgren returned to Lambeau Field for the first time as coach of the Seattle Seahawks. The Seahawks easily disposed of the Packers that day.

And today, a Packers hero that everyone had figured would spend his life in the green and gold trotted out onto the "frozen tundra" wearing the hated Vikings colors. Both of these Packers' heroes moved on because the team hadn't given them everything that they wanted.

But I think it's pretty obvious that this loss stung more.

What to say in the wake of such a loss? Well, subtracting out the larger interest story, the Packers played one half of football and still had the opportunity to drive down and win the game in the 4th quarter. You have to be pretty proud of that if you're a Packers fan. You also have to be proud of Aaron Rodgers - getting up after shot after shot, hobbling around on a clearly tender ankle, but still gutting it out and helping the Packers back into the game.

Green Bay is sitting at 4-3 and is basically an "above average" team at this point. They can dominate lesser competition, play well against equal competition, but not quite get it done against elite teams. Two of their three losses were at the hands of the Vikings, whom they don't have to play anymore. It's obvious that they are only as strong as their weakest link - the offensive line. If the offensive line improves, they will probably make the playoffs and be a very dangerous team.

Mike McCarthy has to get the penalties under control. There needs to be some semblance of a running game, although the lack thereof is probably due to offensive line struggles. And we need to have smarter special teams. Why kick the ball deep to Percy Harvin after several short kickoffs had succeeded? And in the offseason, Ted Thompson needs to bring in more talent on the offensive line.

But this game was about so much more. Brett got his revenge. And that is a bitter pill to swallow for Packers fans. To the casual observer, or intrigued NFL fan, this seems like a great story. Team disowns player. Player travels tough road. Player gets shot at old team. Player beats old team. But the story is so much more complicated than that, and Packers fans know the ugly details.

"I loved Brett as a Packer. I loved him as a person, and I never saw a better football player. And for him to be in a Viking uniform, (it) turns my heart cold. I think of him as a traitor. He let millions of Packer fans down. That's why it hurts. They are going to boo him and they are going to try to run him right off the field." said Fuzzy Thurston, former Packer great. (Source)

For years, the Packers had endured the will-Favre-retire questions after every season. To the rest of the NFL it was just a passing headline, a curiosity. It seemed like the typical situation with an aging NFL star. But the problem was that it happened for many seasons. And it impacted the Packers draft strategies, personnel movements, etc.

Brett Favre actually did retire on March 4, 2008 in a tearful press conference. He said that he had given it all he had and that he was done. Not surprisingly, this allowed the Packers to finally draft for the quarterback position, and they spent two 2008 draft choices on quarterbacks a month later (Brohm, Flynn). In the same time frame, Aaron Rodgers was named the starting quarterback and he started to bond with his team. The Packers were set at the quarterback position, they had planned for the future, and the team was coming together around Aaron Rodgers. This CBS Sports article summarizes a few points nicely:

We've already been here with Favre, remember. We were here last year, too. He announced after the 2006 season that he would decide shortly whether to retire or return in 2007. Shortly dragged on and on, getting in the way of the Packers' offseason plans. Finally Favre decided to return, but only after milking the process for every headline he could get.

It's sad, but it's predictable. He did it again after the 2007 season, saying a decision would come within days, and he was right on the money if by "days" he meant 46 of them. The Packers' season ended Jan. 20 in the NFC title game. He announced his retirement March 6. That means the entire month of February came and went without a decision from Favre -- and this was a leap year.

He must think that building a football team is as simple as looking onto the practice field in July and seeing who shows up. Never mind that the team has to build its offensive personnel, not to mention its entire payroll, around a roster that will, or won't, have a future Hall of Fame quarterback.

Right around the time the draft happened, rumors started swirling about Brett mulling a come back. Did he say anything to that effect to the Packers organization?

When asked at the end of Wednesday's NFC coaches breakfast at the NFL meetings in Palm Beach, Fla., whether Favre might un-retire, Packers coach Mike McCarthy replied: "Time will tell. I don't think so. He's content with his decision. When I talked to him, he'd just gotten off a bulldozer moving trees. He definitely doesn't miss the offseason program.

So, at the beginning of April, Brett Favre had communicated no desire to return. The Packers drafted accordingly, and they were moving on. But then July came around, and things went downhill in a hurry. On July 2nd, reports started coming out that Brett wanted to return to the team. After missing all of the offseason conditioning, and watching the Packers make personnel moves to replace him, all while never indicating a desire to return, he decided that it was time to make a glorious return to Titletown.

Of course, this put the Packers in a very difficult position. They could either go with the status quo and risk alienating a Packers' legend, or they could backtrack all of their offseason planning, bring Brett back, and alienate Aaron Rodgers, while likely having to cut one of their two quarterbacks that were drafted. In effect, the latter would be a waste of two quarterbacks, as one would be cut, and Aaron Rodgers probably would have wanted to move on.

Not surprisingly, Ted Thompson replied to Brett's July 11th letter asking for an unconditional release by denying the request and committing to Aaron Rodgers as the starting quarterback again. He made the smart decision, one that would have the least net negative impact on the entire team, and one that he still catches flak for today.

And this is the point at which Brett showed his colors. He went on "On The Record With Greta Van Susteren" from July 14th through July 15th. He accused the Packers of being dishonest, spoke of his disappointment with Packers management, and said that both parties should just move on.

Obviously we all know how this ends. The question for me has always been this:

If Brett Favre really cared about the Packers organization, if he really cared about them being successful in the present and in the future, why would he force their hand like this?

And I've never been able to answer that. It started with Brett getting the itch to play again. However, when he found out that the Packers' universe didn't revolve around him anymore, he became hell bent on getting revenge against the Packers leadership - the guys who, in his mind, "forced him out of town". Never mind that the Packers had patiently waited, as usual, for months, waiting for him to waffle back onto the team for another season.

Brett didn't care that his return would tear a huge gash in the Packers' relationship with Aaron Rodgers. He didn't care that it started a huge media circus around the team and the training camp, something that noticeably distracted players and coaches. He didn't care. It was all about him. First he wanted to play, and then he wanted to get even.

And this lack of caring for the organization who launched his career, the organization that loved him, the fans that loved him, and the teammates that loved him, is the betrayal. That is why this loss stings so much. He wanted to get his revenge, and didn't care if it was at the cost of tearing Packers Nation apart. He slogged through one year with the Jets, knowing that he was going to bide his time until he could get back into the NFC North Division. Even when he was with the Jets, he admitted that was where he wanted to go.

Even after the FOX News interview, the Packers tried to be accommodating. They even offered to let him come into camp and compete for the job. But Brett didn't want to have to compete for anything - not like the other guys out on the practice field who had already poured their hearts out with effort in training camp. He wanted the job to be handed to him. And one can't help but notice the same trend with how he joined the Vikings. He waited until the week after training camp had ended, before signing. He wanted to step in, on a good team, without having to go through the hard work like everyone else, and just play.

It was the same boyish attitude that made Favre so appealing and likeable early in his career. The guy just loved to play, and he had fun doing it. But the Packers needed a player who was committed to working as hard as everyone else, and showing up in the offseason just like everyone else.

And so, here we are. The Packers - the organization that made the right moves and tried to accommodate Brett while still being faithful to promises made to Aaron Rodgers, and their offseason planning, lost the grudge match today on Lambeau Field; it was on the same field that Brett became a legend. And Brett, the player who returned to get even, well, got even. And somehow, the Packers will likely get made out to be the bad guys in all of this.

Let me close by sharing a little memory. In the 1997 season, I met Brett Favre after a game. The guy seemed carefree and just chatted with me for a couple of minutes about nothing in particular. He talked about how much he loved to play in Green Bay. I really admired his attitude and he was by far my favorite player in the NFL. I felt like I could relate to him, and at the same time I was in awe of the stuff that he could do on the field. I never thought that I'd see this day.

Brett, I've lost a lot of that respect. I thought that you were a guy who cared both about winning and about the organization. I thought that you cared more about the fans, and the Packers in general, than to seek revenge like this. I can't recall another player coming out of retirement to play for revenge - and to do it on the team that is the biggest rival of their former team. It was disgusting to watch you celebrate all over Lambeau Field, with that big grin on your face, while wearing Vikings purple.

I hope that you enjoyed that revenge. I hope that it is sweet enough to you to compensate for your soured reputation among millions of Packers fans. I hope that it was worth it to you. Because all of those fans will never look at you the same way. Packers fans bleed green and gold. Packers players have played for other teams, sure, but none of them have done it for the reasons that you did, or in the fashion that you did.

And I guess that makes you special.

That's what you wanted, right?

Why not spread it out more?

2009-11-02T03:10:13Z

I happen to live in Eugene, OR and I saw the Oregon Ducks destroy one of the best defenses USC on Halloween . Oregon runs a spread option most plays and is always in the shotgun formation. Then whilst viewing the Green Bay Minnesota game the first half McCarthy had Rodgers under center dropping back with tight formations. Neither the run game or the pass game was there. Then comes the 2nd half and the Packers put 3 or more receivers out and Aaron starts picking the defense apart. Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe the packers ran a form of the spread back in 2007 with great success with Flarve or whatever his name was. With a shotgun spread i see Aaron Rodgers explioting blitzs, the wideouts getting Yards after Catch in the open field, Rodgers getting yards with his legs, better protection, I also think the spread will allow Grant this use his speed and power better in the open field. What do you guys think? Is my analysis asinine (stupid)? Perhaps. I read an article in the Wall street journal talking about why scoring is higher than average this season and part of it is the use of the spread offense. I wish we'd go with more spread earlier in the game and on first downs but I could be wrong. Not all teams can run spread because they don't have a good enough QB and HB but I think we do. Aaron Rodgers is our best player and and he does better (I think) with the spread. I have no stats to back me up so I don't know if I'm right or not. What is your opinion?

Thank You, NFL Schedulemakers

2009-11-01T14:02:44Z

Going into this week, I was tired of not having the ability to watch Green Bay play in non-nationally televised games. Except for the opening game against Chicago, the Minnesota game, and the Baltimore game later this year, the most Packer football I get to see most Sundays is during halftime shows and highlight packages on NFL.com. Considering a fair amount of my free time goes into writing for this site, not being able to see what the readers are seeing is a severe handicap.

It wouldn't be so bad if I didn't live in the New York TV market, leaving me to choose between Giants and Jets games. Don't get me wrong, both teams are fun to watch, but it feels almost...wrong.

Going into this week, I decided on a whim to check the New York teams' schedules. Originally, the Jets were scheduled for 1:00 PM and the Giants were slated to play at 4:15 PM. I had forgotten about the announcement earlier this season that the Giants game (at Philadelphia) would be moving up to 1:00 PM...and the Green Bay-Minnesota tilt was pushed to 4:15.

But it couldn't be that easy, could it? It has to be too good to be true, doesn't it? That was my attitude when I woke up this morning (at 2 AM...working third shift during the week is a bitch). I decided to check the TV schedule for the day, just to further my misery.

At 4:00 PM, CBS is showing bull riding. Awesome. On FOX, immediately following the Giants game, they're showing Minnesota at Green Bay.

...Wait, what?

Awesome.

Consider this your pre-game live thread until Brandon publishes the real game thread. Enjoy your morning, gents. I know I will...because at 4:00 PM (3:00 central)...it's on.

Interesting article on TT...oh no you di'int

2009-10-29T16:40:50Z

"There's no way the Packers could've won this thing, no matter how it came out," says former Green Bay general manager Ron Wolf, who traded for Favre 18 years ago. "And it will always be attached to Ted. That's just the nature of the game and the business."

I would love to hear Wolf's entire take on it...both when it happened and now just to see how he would have handled it. For all we know he may have done the same thing, Wolf put the team before the players too...remember he trained TT. Either way, I think Wolf was spot on. If we brought Favre back it would have been at the expense of Rodgers. If we let Favre go its at the expense of some of the fans. Not a decision that would have been fun to make...that much I know.

The biggest influences in TT life according to him are: Titan GM Mike Reinfeldt, Wolf, Phillips, former Packers and Seahawks coach Mike Holmgren, and his own parents. In fact Bum Phillips said TT is one of the few people he would trust his life with.

Thompson is known for being a shrewd evaluator of talent, some here will argue that but his record in Seattle spoke for that and he was key to Wolf in his years here. His first job with us was as a scout. He'd sit in a dark room for hours watching tape of players. He was successful and became director of pro personnel before Holmgren lured him away in 2000. Who knows, if he hadn't TT might have been Wolf's successor years earlier.

I think this right here though is the one thing that will make or break his time here...

Thompson is always looking five years into the future. He collects picks, and believes that the core of a team should come from the draft. He scoffs at the draft-day notion that a franchise would lock itself in according to need; sometimes, if the talent is still out there, you have to grab it.

I don't think he's ever going to just sit there and make a play for just this year. He runs this organization like the Twin in baseball. Make sure the team is always relevant and stocked for the future. Build through the draft and develop the talent and reward those that succeed.

Read the full article though, its very interesting and helps you learn more about TT and stuff. Its long but well written.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?page=hotread7/TedThompson

what to with jersey # 4

2009-10-29T01:39:52Z

not taking anything away from the great Brett Farve but as a packer fan of over thirty years and living so close to Minnesota the biggest let down of his career was joining the Queens. The man has always been a joy to watch play his game. But I feel he betrayed the fans and the franchise by joining the Queens. I feel because of this the # 4 jersey should be given to a rookie Quarterback and when he Passes away then retire the Jersey.

Ask a Vikings Fan

2009-10-28T20:22:14Z

Hey Packer fans. We are a little under 5 hours away from as FOX billed "The Game Of the Year". This could quite possibly be the greatest game ever played between the Packers and the Vikings. Lets hope for a great game between both teams.

I would like to just come over here and throw it out there that you guys can ask me any questions about the Vikings so far if you have any. So ask away.